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Ville Vinje
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 Posted: Wed 04 Apr, 2007 4:18 am Post subject: oil drenched chainmail |
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I recently purchased a chainmail hauberk from GDFB and found it to be totaly drenched in oil. There was so much oil on the mail that I could not touch it without getting black all over my arms. I have tries to wipe of the oil using various cloth but the chainmail i so drenched in oil that it hardly makes any difference.
Some of you guys must have encountered this problem to.
My question is thus: How do I remove the excessive oil from the chainmail without risking it to rust to much?
Regards,
Ville
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Jonathan Blair
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| Posted: Wed 04 Apr, 2007 6:04 am Post subject: |
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Get used to the oil. Better black stained fingers and clothes than a rusty maille shirt.
"Think not that I am come to send peace on earth: I came not to send peace, but a sword." - The Lord Jesus Christ, from The Gospel According to Saint Matthew, chapter x, verse 34, Authorized Version of 1611
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Elling Polden
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| Posted: Wed 04 Apr, 2007 6:12 am Post subject: |
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The oil is worn of after a while. Alternately, you can just "dry" it by leaving it on a heater.
You will need a dedicated arming coat or shirt either way, as oil or rust will stain any clothes worn under mail.
"this [fight] looks curious, almost like a game. See, they are looking around them before they fall, to find a dry spot to fall on, or they are falling on their shields. Can you see blood on their cloths and weapons? No. This must be trickery."
-Reidar Sendeman, from King Sverre's Saga, 1201
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Robin Smith
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| Posted: Wed 04 Apr, 2007 6:13 am Post subject: |
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First off, oil is period. Looking like a coal miner is period. You should see my gambeson. The oil will wear off as you fight in it. After that, apply minimal amounts to prevent rusting, but there is always gonna be some black on you and your garb...
Second, if you really want it gone, you can strip your maille with brake cleaner, and coat it with future floor polish. I have heard any acrylic floor polish will work, but future was specifically recommended as it is designed to resist abrasion. I haven't done this to my hauberk, but I have experimented with it on the remnants of the sleeves when I shortened them to proper elbow length. We coated it, and left them outside in Louisiana at a friends house. They have gotten more than a months worth of rain, and still no rust (and this IS Louisiana)...
A furore Normannorum libera nos, Domine
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Jim Adelsen
Industry Professional
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| Posted: Wed 04 Apr, 2007 8:52 am Post subject: |
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I've wondered about this myself. What sort of oil would be historically used?
www.viking-shield.com
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Robin Smith
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| Posted: Wed 04 Apr, 2007 10:03 am Post subject: |
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I have heard pigs fat was used, but am not sure if that is true or not. If it is, it must have been might smelly, under the hot Jerusalem sun...
A furore Normannorum libera nos, Domine
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Jim Adelsen
Industry Professional
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| Posted: Wed 04 Apr, 2007 10:43 am Post subject: |
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That couldn't have smelled good.
And what happens when you use the barrel and sand method to clean the mail? I would think the sand would stick to the mail and it would be quite a mess.
I am curious how long mail would last if you just tried to keep it dry and cleaned off the surface rust regularly with the barrel method?
| Robin Smith wrote: | | I have heard pigs fat was used, but am not sure if that is true or not. If it is, it must have been might smelly, under the hot Jerusalem sun... |
www.viking-shield.com
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Robin Smith
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| Posted: Wed 04 Apr, 2007 10:53 am Post subject: |
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Probably awhile, but its losing metal each time.
As I said, if you really don't like the oil, then sealing the maille with Future Floor Polish is the way to go. The maille will need to be resealed every so often, lest it rust where the polish has worn through, but it works. I know a couple of people who swear by it (Steve of Forth Armoury does this I believe)...
A furore Normannorum libera nos, Domine
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Andrew Fox
Location: S.F. Bay Area Joined: 25 Jan 2004
Posts: 50
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| Posted: Wed 04 Apr, 2007 11:01 am Post subject: |
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If you really hate the oil then do what a friend of mine did and take it down to the local garage and have them wash it off in their parts cleaner. In his case the mechanic thought it was amusing so he cleaned it for free. 
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Robin Smith
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| Posted: Wed 04 Apr, 2007 11:05 am Post subject: |
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You don't need to do that... Any spray brake cleaner or carburator cleaner that you can get at an autoparts store works great. That is what I use to degrease before a vinegar bath. I have heard CRC brakleen isn't great, but almost anyother brand will do fine...
A furore Normannorum libera nos, Domine
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Joe Loder
Location: Milwaukee, WI Joined: 10 Mar 2006
Posts: 36
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| Posted: Wed 04 Apr, 2007 12:03 pm Post subject: |
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Does the gunk just come off the maille after you spray it or do you have to scrub the beejeezus out of it with something?
He who laughs last, thinks fastest.
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Elling Polden
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| Posted: Wed 04 Apr, 2007 12:33 pm Post subject: |
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| Joe Loder wrote: | | Does the gunk just come off the maille after you spray it or do you have to scrub the beejeezus out of it with something? |
It dissolves and drizzles up. The remains dry out.
Be advised that it's a good idea to apply a thin layer of oil afterwards, as the process "dries out" the metal, making it more susceptible to rust later on.
"this [fight] looks curious, almost like a game. See, they are looking around them before they fall, to find a dry spot to fall on, or they are falling on their shields. Can you see blood on their cloths and weapons? No. This must be trickery."
-Reidar Sendeman, from King Sverre's Saga, 1201
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Joe Loder
Location: Milwaukee, WI Joined: 10 Mar 2006
Posts: 36
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| Posted: Wed 04 Apr, 2007 12:46 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | It dissolves and drizzles up. The remains dry out. |
Oh that is just tremendously neat. I want to clean a bunch of the rings and fabric that I've been using and was wondering how to get the fabric shiny too. I'll give this a shot soon as I finish my next chunk of riveted maille. Thanks for the info guys!
~ Joe
He who laughs last, thinks fastest.
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Jim Adelsen
Industry Professional
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| Posted: Wed 04 Apr, 2007 1:31 pm Post subject: |
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I'm not worried about the oil, just curious how it was cared for historically.
| Robin Smith wrote: | Probably awhile, but its losing metal each time.
As I said, if you really don't like the oil, then sealing the maille with Future Floor Polish is the way to go. The maille will need to be resealed every so often, lest it rust where the polish has worn through, but it works. I know a couple of people who swear by it (Steve of Forth Armoury does this I believe)... |
www.viking-shield.com
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Ville Vinje
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| Posted: Wed 04 Apr, 2007 3:51 pm Post subject: |
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Thanks everyone!
Your advice is most helpful. I will let you know how it worked out.
Regards,
/Ville
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Jean Thibodeau
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| Posted: Wed 04 Apr, 2007 7:23 pm Post subject: |
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| Robin Smith wrote: | Probably awhile, but its losing metal each time.
As I said, if you really don't like the oil, then sealing the maille with Future Floor Polish is the way to go. The maille will need to be resealed every so often, lest it rust where the polish has worn through, but it works. I know a couple of people who swear by it (Steve of Forth Armoury does this I believe)... |
Sounds good.  I wonder if Future floor polish would be also a good rust protection for plate armour ?
How often, if ever, does one have to refresh the polish ? Will have to see if that brand is available locally in Montreal: If it's a major National brand it should be ! ( sounds vaguely familiar ).
If the specific brand is hard to find how is it described as far as ingredients ! Most competitive products would tend to be very similar I think ( most brands of almost everything are most always the same unless there is an ingredient under some sort of patent protection ).
You can easily give up your freedom. You have to fight hard to get it back!
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Robin Smith
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| Posted: Wed 04 Apr, 2007 7:39 pm Post subject: |
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Any acrylic floor polish should work. It is designed to resist scuffs and seal against moisture. As for how often it needs to be re applied, well that I don't know. I guess before it rusts 
For protecting plate, I don't see why not. A friend of mine sealed his helm and gaunts with the acrylic spray sealer. He said it worked great until it didn't, if you get what I mean. But then again, he wasn't very diligent about reapplying on a regular basis, and it was being worn and fought in weekly...
A furore Normannorum libera nos, Domine
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Jean Thibodeau
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| Posted: Wed 04 Apr, 2007 8:14 pm Post subject: |
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| Robin Smith wrote: | Any acrylic floor polish should work. It is designed to resist scuffs and seal against moisture. As for how often it needs to be re applied, well that I don't know. I guess before it rusts
For protecting plate, I don't see why not. A friend of mine sealed his helm and gaunts with the acrylic spray sealer. He said it worked great until it didn't, if you get what I mean. But then again, he wasn't very diligent about reapplying on a regular basis, and it was being worn and fought in weekly... |
Yes, if rust shows up I guess it wore of and wasn't reapplied often enough. 
I would think giving the armour a little wipe before going outdoors " in the rain " or after wearing it outdoors would be a good time to reapply. Or, dusting the old armour off once in a while and adding a little polish then.
Oh, if living in a cold climate coming in from the cold will cause condensation on cold metal. ( So another good time to think about a quick wipe off at least ).
The good thing though is that it just seems that a little preventative maintenance is all that is needed short of being caught in a salt spray near the ocean. 
And thanks for the reply and the good tip.
You can easily give up your freedom. You have to fight hard to get it back!
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Nick Trueman
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| Posted: Wed 04 Apr, 2007 8:48 pm Post subject: |
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Is it from India?
If so some of the makers cover it in graphite/oil. Its a bugger! While I agree the oil look is period this is taking it a bit far. I was covered head to toe in black gunk!
I did the naughty thing and soaked it in petrol in a plastic bucket afterwards rubbing it with a old towel before oiling again in lanolin.
N
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Eric Allen
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| Posted: Wed 04 Apr, 2007 9:14 pm Post subject: |
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Pine-Sol will take the oil off of mail as well.
About "Getting greasy from the oil being period," How do we know? I know of sources saying the sand-in-a-barrel method, but do we actually have any (primary) sources describing oil on mail? Inquiring minds want to know. 
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This is a standard topic