[Mark T]

Hi all,

I'm thinking of asking Mark Vickers of St George Armoury to make me a custom buckler, based on the ones in Talhoffer's Fechtbuch (1467, as in the pic below - not the 'extra spikey' version shown in the 1459 Thott Codex).

Below are photos of Mark's standard version of this buckler; I'm going to request a spiked coppola/boss.

From a reproduction point of view, I have two questions:

Would a tubular handle like this have been used in period? The best view we have of the handle in Talhoffer is plate 238, and the handle shown there does appear to be tubular.

Question two:

[Mark T]

Here is the view of the buckler handle from Talhoffer's 1467 plate 238. I'll post two versions, as the handle detail is a little hard to make out. It's easier to see in Rector's Medieval combat.

[Mark T]

And, just for comparison, the handle in Talhoffer 1459 (Thott Codex):

[Craig Shackleton]

There is a surviving example of a very similar buckler... somewhere. I've seen photos of it but I don't remember where. I don't know what the handles were like historically, at least not from looking at artifacts.

But!

That handle looks like it gives you enough room to turn the buckler on your hand if you want to. It's really about how deep the bowl is at the handle, so with a deep bowl, you don't need a set back handle.

Regardless, it is more effective (both faster and stronger) to switch your hand from pronated to supinated position to change the angle of the buckler, which does not require extra room in the boss. One of my bucklers has to be jammed onto my hand because the grip is so snug, but I can still use it for these techniques.

On the other hand. I am skeptical of the effectiveness of that style of buckler for I.33 for two reasons. The shape looks like it will make it difficult to do some of the transition that involve slipping your buckler under your sword arm. Also, the buckler is used for pinning in I.33, and never shown used for attacking directly. I suspect that the angled structure will be harder to pin with. These are my guesses having never used a buckler like that.

I do think it's a beautiful buckler, and I'd love to get one myself. If I did, I would certainly try it for I.33, I just wouldn't have high hopes. Talhoffer does his own cool stuff with that buckler, although he didn't leave us very much information about it.

If you do get this buckler, I'd love to hear how it works out for you. I really like this style and have thought about getting one for years. I don't know why I haven't yet.

Another maker that has similar bucklers is http://www.armorymarek.com/shields . In this case he's definitely got the handle running the wrong way (horizontal instead of vertical) but I imagine he could change that. The shape of the buckler is certainly lovely.

[Craig Shackleton]

The actual buckler I've seen is posted by Matt Easton (sort of) in this thread:

http://www.myArmoury.com/talk/viewtopic.php?t...p;start=20

[Hugh Knight]

[Craig Shackleton]

Hugh, that's a beautiful buckler. Does Greg sell them? The size looks good to me. I like an 11 inch diameter buckler when using a round one, because anything bigger hampers some of the techniques, at least a little.

[Mark T]

Hi Craig and Hugh,

Thanks for your replies.

[Hugh Knight]

[Mark T]

Hugh: I forgot to say thanks for having posted pics of yours on your original thread ... seeing those helped me explore options for getting my own made up.

Does anyone else have photos of a Talhoffer-style buckler they'd like to share, or experience in using one?

[Hugh Knight]

[Mark T]

[Hugh Knight]

[Mark T]

Here's another pic from the thread about Hugh's buckler which gives a different sense of its shape, as well as the curve on the tips that we're discussing:

[Bradley M Cramer Jr]

does anyone sell these?

[Craig Shackleton]

I have now ordered one of these from Armory Marek, asking them to align the handle correctly, but I haven't received it yet. I ordered a few things from them, and I'll give a mini review once I have them.

[Nathan Robinson]

[Mark T]

[Craig Shackleton]

I received my buckler (along with two messers and a longsword) from armory marek today.

They have posted new pictures on their website, which show my specific buckler. I'm guessing that based on the image I sent them from Talhoffer, they realized that their old grip style was incorrect.



The buckler is flatter than I expected. The crease lines are really just that; crease lines with no real depth. The upside is that the boss gives the impression of a point, but is not actually pointy. I won't be poking anyone with the point when I shieldknock.

It is also a little on the heavy side for my preference, but not outrageous, at 2 lb, 13 oz.. Still lighter than the lightest GDFB manhole cover/12 inch buckler. One reason it is heavy is that instead of rolling the edges, they welded on light round bar stock (~4mm).

The grip is just flat stock which I will need to wrap with something (or I may just replace it with a wooden grip).

The finish is good, service was great, and I am happy with the transaction.

As an aside, the other items I received are beautifully made, but slightly overbuilt. Since they arrived less than an hour ago, I have not played with them in earnest.

[Simon G.]

Craig,

Congrats on your new buckler and other items. This buckler still looks very good if indeed a bit flat. I think if I ever get past my obsessing love of two-handed weapons and order a buckler, I'll get the same as yours.

I too recieved items from Armory Marek a little while ago and had the same impression as you - pretty but a bit overbuilt. I would be very interested in knowing which items you got and what's your impression of them, as I'll probably order again from Marek in the future. And I really need to get around to writing a review of the items I already bought...