[Colt Reeves]

As seen here: http://www.youtube.com/user/SkinnyGuy31#p/a/u/0/g0bPkolJuP4

"This may be proof of ADD or something, but I've switched from German longsword to an attempt at some rapier work. I start with a technique from Capo Ferro (also German) and then try Salvator Fabris (Italian). I'll go back to the longsword stuff soon enough though. I just have a short attention span and like to bounce around.

It comes to me a little easier than the longsword work I think, given that I just got the sucker today and never touched one before. It's a Hanwei Bone Handled Swept Hilt Rapier, try saying that five times fast.

I think it is a little whippy since you can see the blade droop in the video and I have heard a lot about how historical rapiers were usually rather stiff. Because of the balance, it also seems very light compared to my other swords... at first. Holding it out at arms-length repeatedly gets a little old. I hasten to clarify that this feeling comes from the weight being largely in the hilt. It is only 5 ounces less than the Hanwei War Sword I show in my other video. It is largely a myth that rapiers were much lighter than the swords that came before them.

Disclaimer: I have, as mentioned above, never done this before and have had no official training. I welcome any useful advice. I intend to keep at this and upload a bigger video with more techniques in the future. Offer subject to limited terms and conditions. See participating stores for details.

Oh, and that is Blue Oyster Cult, Veterans of the Psychic Wars, in the background. Next time I'll turn it up so the audience can hear my bad/great taste in music."

So, as before with my attempt at German Longsword, I am posting here in the hopes that people will give me some advice. I only did two moves so picking it apart should be a little easier.

[Steven Reich]

[Glennan Carnie]

I have to say I'm really disappointed to see this thread.

Just one week ago you posted a video of yourself attempting some German longsword techniques, asking for criticism. A lot of very knowledgeable, very talented people went out of their way to offer you constructive criticism.

And now, a mere week later, you have decided to try the rapier, because "It comes to me a little easier than the longsword work I think, given that I just got the sucker today and never touched one before" (Ummm... no it doesn't.)

It would have been nice to have seen a video from you saying "I've been practising what you pointed out to me; have I improved?"

Fencing and instant gratification are not comfortable bedfellows. If you want to get better - with any weapon - it means putting in practice. And that means doing lots and lots of boring stuff, like footwork drills. The basic flaws identified in your technique will take you months - if not years - of training to get rid of. You can't get better just by asking for comments.

I'm afraid if you're not prepared to put the effort in you'll always look like a kid swinging his sword around in his bedroom.

Others may not see it this way (and that's good, because I'm not renowned for my generosity and I'd like to think there are still some good-hearted people in this world) but I see this as an insult to all those who offered to help you.

[Jim Mearkle]

I have to agree with Glennan. Pick one, stick to it, learn it, then if you want to branch out, you can, but I suspect trying to learn the basics of two different systems will only slow you down, and possibly lead to bad habits.

It takes 300-500 repetitions of a motion to really learn it, but if you learn it wrong, it then takes 3000-5000 repetitions to unlearn and relearn it correctly.

Without instruction from someone who knows what they are doing, you're almost certain to pick up bad habits. If there are any WMA schools near you, look into what they offer. If there is a longsword school near you, go that route. If there is a rapier school, do that. If you are lucky enough to have both, try three months of one, then three months at the other, then pick one and stick to it.

Here are some lists of WMA clubs and schools:

http://hroarr.com/organisations-and-clubs.html
http://www.hemaalliance.com/?page_id=331
http://www.communitywalk.com/THE-HEMA-ALLIANC...ner-Finder

[Michael Edelson]

[Colt Reeves]

My apologies, I did not mean to insult. I have been working on applying the advice I was given concerning the longsword, but wanted to play with my new toy (as noted I just received it yesterday).

Concerning nearby schools, I already looked into that and the nearest is a 45 minute plane ride followed by a 22 minute drive (which would obviously be a rental or taxi, since I don't know anyone over there). Back home it's a two-three hour drive if I remember correctly. Neither are impossible, but both take up time and money and if I go for the three months you recommend I would have to do that during break two semesters from now and skip working or find a local job. I'm sorry, I realize I can't learn this from Youtube and whathaveyou, but at this particular time and place it is simply the easiest option and I'll admit I am lazy.

Let me ask you this (I am serious and not ranting): Given my apparent lack of dedication, do you recommend forgetting about the swords and simply putting them aside until such time I as go out and find a teacher? Would you simply prefer I do not bother the board and waste your time? Do you feel I am misrepresenting myself as someone who intends to practice six hours a day?


Again, I do not wish to insult or anything, I spent probably twenty minutes here looking this post over and debating whether to submit it. If you feel I am not worthy of your advice or treat it too lightly I will not ask for it in the future.

[Steven Reich]

Colt,

Part of being young is that you waste time you'll wish you could have back when you're older (speaking from personal experience). I don't personally see anything wrong with meandering to see what draws you (i.e. what type of swordsmanship)--at some point, if you decide to get serious, you'll figure out what you have to do.

While the ideal is to have personal instruction, even in the case that you do, your fundamentals will be learned and reinforced by much solo practice. If you learn to correctly advance, retreat, lunge, and recover on your own, then when you do get a chance to take lessons, your time will be more productive.

The great thing about the rapier is that you're far less likely to destroy your ceiling or furniture or accidentally hit anyone when practicing indoors as compared to practicing indoors with the longsword. I have to echo what Michael said--keep practicing. Of course, when you first pick up the sword, you want to use it (i.e. fence). However, if you stick with it long enough, you start to see what else there is to studying swordsmanship--an unending series of drills and practice. While this might not seem appealing initially, at some point, you'll grow to appreciate the physical and mental challenge of the more "mundane" aspects of your art (and you'll realize that they aren't actually mundane).

I hope that you'll pick one or the other (or both) and stick with it. Not out of any disappointment on my part, but because I think that that is how you get everything out of swordsmanship that it has to offer...

Steve

[Michael Edelson]

[Jean Thibodeau]

Colt: If you have a passion for it, go for it, but you may stumble around a bit before you find focus and know what you want.

Those who are " serious " trainers are serious because they care about getting better and have put in the time needed to get better but at the bottom of it all they have to follow their hearts and do something they care about: No one keeps putting in the work if they don't eventually get something out of it and that may be just having fun or the feeling of having worked hard and attained some goal or skill or even if they never get good at it performance wise they are getting knowledge they value about how it was done. ( You are the final judge in choosing the goal you set yourself ).

The tedious stuff seems tedious in part because initially it all seems the same whether you are doing it well or badly because without a lot of practice and study one can't tell the difference between good execution of a technique and a sloppy approximation of a technique.


I'm with Michael in that nobody forced me to post and give an opinion: If it helps you good and I'm glad, but I guess I post first for my own satisfaction and because I enjoy the discussions and I wasn't insulted or offended.

I'm not a teacher but I can also be pedantic and annoying and verbose.

( Note: At the same time Glennan is absolutely entitled to his opinion, and although I wouldn't be crushed by it, reflecting on his opinion and taking is opinion seriously is worth while. Everyone we meet is like a mirror, not necessarily a true mirror, but we can always learn something from the way someone else has perceived us ).

[Neil Langley]

[Colt Reeves]

Well, I thank you again for any and all criticism and advice. I can see where you are coming from Glennan, and I apologize again.

Just to clarify my position though, I have ordered two longsword blunts for safer training, Christian Henry Tobler's Fighting with the German Longsword, and The Longsword of Johannes Leckuchner DVD. Concerning the rapier, all I have ordered is a blunt so I can switch out the blades.

Despite my earlier flippant tone my main focus has been and continues to be German Longsword. So I guess what I am saying is that if you are insulted that I am taking advice and criticism for granted, it isn't that of the longsword I am taking lightly, it is that of the rapier. That doesn't change the insult, but it changes the target a little.



Michael Edelson wrote:

[Isaac H.]

This is turning into quite an interesting thread.

I must agree with Glennan on this one,pick a weapon(s) and stick with it. I am very knowledgeable in rapier fencing,as I have been both studying and practicing (and lately teaching) at my local school the Diamond Rose Academie,for over four years.This weapon is amazing,and I wholly recommend you study it.There are so many things you can learn;French, German ,Spanish ,and Italian styles of fighting,using rapier in combination with buckler,cloak,dagger,brace.....the possibillities for learning are endless! After four years I have just begun to scratch the surface.In other words,exactly what Glennan wrote previously ...."fencing and instant gratification are not comfortable bedfellows". Nicely put man.

You really didn't do too bad for having never picked up a rapier. What Mr Reich wrote about extending your sword totally before moving is crucial.If you lunge with a bent arm and your opponent lunges fully extended ....it's off to Davy Jones locker for you
Though not as important and more as a matter of opinion,you will get far better tip control with such a fast sword if you hold it with your palm towards the sky(suppination).Also ,I wouldn't recommend squarring up so much on your recovery;it leaves you wide open to sneaky counterattacks.
Just keep in mind that everything in rapier fencing is fluid and efficient.You aren't bashing skulls,you're poking holes.Never move more than necessary to send your enemy to his grave.Congrats on your new sword , I hope it's put to good use.Any questions or comments... go for it.

[Colt Reeves]

I should make sure to put a qualifier on my statement about taking the rapier advice lightly. By lightly I mean relative to the longsword. It will by no means be ignored or unpracticed. I'm sure many of you have preferences for certain weapons or styles despite practicing with several.

[Steven Reich]

[Isaac H.]

well now I certainly don't want to be guilty of ego boosting.....Mr Reich

Don't worry,you are officially "Steve" from now on.

[Michael R. Black]

I'm only a novice swordperson, but I did study shotokan karate for roughly 25 years, with some teaching thrown in along the way. Also did a little aikido and judo.

I think it is good to check out a few different styles/arts before committing to one.

michael