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Jakub Oupic





Joined: 19 May 2010

Posts: 5

PostPosted: Wed 19 May, 2010 3:25 am    Post subject: Saber similar to katana         Reply with quote

Hi, I am a new member here and I have one question. Before three months I find on net few photos of oriental sabre (I don't know it was from Persia or Iran) scanned from any book. The sabre was very similar to katana. Can you say me what is the name of this arm? Thank you very much.
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Tomas Mihalyi




Location: Slovakia
Joined: 14 Sep 2009

Posts: 21

PostPosted: Wed 19 May, 2010 4:29 am    Post subject: Re: Saber similar to katana         Reply with quote

Jakub Oupic wrote:
Hi, I am a new member here and I have one question. Before three months I find on net few photos of oriental sabre (I don't know it was from Persia or Iran) scanned from any book. The sabre was very similar to katana. Can you say me what is the name of this arm? Thank you very much.


could you at least post some fotos of that sabre... otherwise I have no idea which one do you mean.... or a period of its occurrence...
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Jakub Oupic





Joined: 19 May 2010

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PostPosted: Wed 19 May, 2010 4:46 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

I haven't any photos of this weapon. I don't remember where I found these images. I think that this weapon is from second half of 19th century. Photos was scanned from any book, but I don't remember more.
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William Goodwin




Location: Roanoke,Va
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PostPosted: Wed 19 May, 2010 4:59 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

could you be referring to Hanwei's Dark Sentinal?


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Jakub Oupic





Joined: 19 May 2010

Posts: 5

PostPosted: Wed 19 May, 2010 5:07 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

It is a similar, but this is not this weapon. Hilt was shorter and blade wasn't so curved. And it wasn't fantasy weapon. Photos were BW and man which bear this weapon have also little shield as a buckler.
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Walter S




Location: Czech Republic
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PostPosted: Wed 19 May, 2010 5:56 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

I suppose this is kinda random, but what about a tulwar?
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Sam Barris




Location: San Diego, California
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PostPosted: Wed 19 May, 2010 6:15 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

A Swiss Saber, perhaps?
Pax,
Sam Barris

"Any nation that draws too great a distinction between its scholars and its warriors will have its thinking done by cowards, and its fighting done by fools." —Thucydides
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Jakub Oupic





Joined: 19 May 2010

Posts: 5

PostPosted: Wed 19 May, 2010 6:33 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

It was not tulwar. I know basic types of sabers, but I haven't seen this weapon before. I remember that this weapon is from Iran or Persia. I think the photos were on any forum about swords, but I'm not sure.
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Peter Johnsson
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PostPosted: Wed 19 May, 2010 7:56 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Perhaps it is an Alan sword? A horse people invading western europe ( in 4th or 5th c AD?)
I think this sword is from 5th C, but I have mislaid my notes on this one for the moment. There are also single hand sabers of the Alans that are almost straight and do look rather like katanas in outline of the blade. These are a bit later. At around 7th or 8th C I think.
IŽll post when I find those mages.



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Gottfried P. Doerler




Location: Tyrol, Austria
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PostPosted: Wed 19 May, 2010 3:14 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

i heard once, the japanese were on a westernisation-trip in the late 19th century
and in this context sometimes fittet saber-hilts to katana blades (i don`t know if this is true),
and returened to the real katana in the 1930s with growing nationalism.

maybe this picture really depicts such a "saber-katana" ??
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Boris R.





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PostPosted: Wed 19 May, 2010 3:44 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

a saber-katana? so basically a sabatana Idea
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J Anstey





Joined: 21 Jul 2007

Posts: 233

PostPosted: Wed 19 May, 2010 9:43 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Gottfried P. Doerler wrote:
i heard once, the japanese were on a westernisation-trip in the late 19th century
and in this context sometimes fittet saber-hilts to katana blades (i don`t know if this is true),
and returened to the real katana in the 1930s with growing nationalism.

maybe this picture really depicts such a "saber-katana" ??


You are correct, the kyu-gunto has a very western appearance with the sabre hilt mounted on a katana blade. THese came about in the Meiji and Showa times for military use. See attachment.

Sorry for the thread divergence



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Lucas Simms




Location: Washington
Joined: 14 Mar 2010

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PostPosted: Thu 20 May, 2010 7:50 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

J Anstey wrote:
Gottfried P. Doerler wrote:
i heard once, the japanese were on a westernisation-trip in the late 19th century
and in this context sometimes fittet saber-hilts to katana blades (i don`t know if this is true),
and returened to the real katana in the 1930s with growing nationalism.

maybe this picture really depicts such a "saber-katana" ??


You are correct, the kyu-gunto has a very western appearance with the sabre hilt mounted on a katana blade. THese came about in the Meiji and Showa times for military use. See attachment.

Sorry for the thread divergence


that actually looks pretty nice

Lucas
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Gottfried P. Doerler




Location: Tyrol, Austria
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PostPosted: Thu 20 May, 2010 7:54 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

yes, thats quite interesting. maybe jakub meant one of these.
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J Anstey





Joined: 21 Jul 2007

Posts: 233

PostPosted: Thu 20 May, 2010 7:19 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

some officers kyu gunto were very nice although I have always found the concept to be quite bizarre.

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Jakub Oupic





Joined: 19 May 2010

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PostPosted: Thu 20 May, 2010 10:35 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Thank you very much. I saw another weapon, but the type was the same. I'm your payer.
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Paul Hansen




Location: The Netherlands
Joined: 17 Mar 2005
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PostPosted: Sun 30 May, 2010 1:35 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Peter Johnsson wrote:
Perhaps it is an Alan sword? A horse people invading western europe ( in 4th or 5th c AD?)
I think this sword is from 5th C, but I have mislaid my notes on this one for the moment. There are also single hand sabers of the Alans that are almost straight and do look rather like katanas in outline of the blade. These are a bit later. At around 7th or 8th C I think.
IŽll post when I find those mages.


Hi Peter,
It took a while but I managed to find this sword in "Attila und die Hunnen".

It's from Kurgan 2, Brut, North Ossetia, Caucasus, and thought to be of Alan origin, dating approx. 4th-5th. C.

So you have pretty good memory. Wink

It's double edged though...
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Dan Dickinson
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Location: Michigan
Joined: 03 Oct 2004

Posts: 967

PostPosted: Sun 30 May, 2010 1:48 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Are you perhaps talking about a saber such as number 794? It's description is:

"Sabre from Szekes-Fejervar, Hungary, 10th-11th centuries (National Museum, Budapest, Hungary)
This beautiful sabre has a non-tapering blade with an angled tip. In many respects it recalls some fine, and very much later, Japanese swords. The origins of both groups of weapons almost certainly lay in Central Asia. The bulbous quillons are of an unusual and probably early form."


I hope this helps,
Dan


(image taken from David Nicolle's, Arms & Armour of the Crusading Era 1050-1350: Western Europe and the Crusader States)
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