[Jared Smith]

Was it common for 10th through 13th century swords to have guards and pommels "forged" to fit around the blade and tang?

My interest is primarily in the classic cruciform sword of the early medieval knight. I have seen a couple of modern high priced pattern welded creations that sport pattern welded guards and pommels. These were supposedly created with "traditional" methods which makes me wonder if one could literally forge the guard and pommel around the blade, and then finish to final shape with filing.

[Peter Johnsson]

[John Cooksey]

[Guy Thomas]

I have Geibig's book at home and some of the guards featured look to have had little more than a slit created by hot cutting with little refinment of the tang opening. Some others have the appearance that they were made by folding and welding a long piece of stock back on itself leaving the opening for the tang, it's hard to say though since these impressions could also have been created by the fibrous nature of the iron, the practice of welding up smaller pieces of iron to create bar stock and the damage from rusting. All in all hilt components, like swords themselves seem to range from poorly made to those obviously made by craftsmen as skilled as the best blademsiths. Which brings another question to my mind, by the early medieval period would hilt components have been made by your average swordsmith or would another craftsman have generally done that?

[Chad Arnow]

I read somewhere (I believe more than one source) about some guards being forged closed around the tang. Some of them have come apart (ie. degraded) where they were forge-welded. If I recall correctly, the guard was basically formed separately, but with a slot left open for the tang on one side (top to bottom) and some flaps of material that would be forged around the tang, enclosing it.

[Jared Smith]

Thanks for the insights Peter.

I hope to attempt my own first sword one of these years. I have always liked the look of twisted metal bar guards and other furniture that appears to be hand forged. I had wondered if these were made in two halves followed by welding together, but think punching with custom drifts makes a lot more sense than getting something incomplete stuck (forged) onto a good blade!

[Peter Johnsson]

I think that in those cases where guards and pommels are obviously forge welded together (you do see this a lot, especially on viking era and high medieval era swords, but also on later pieces like Sciavonesca hilts) one should not assume the guard is forge welded in place on the tang of the sword. Rather a separate tool was used for the final shaping of the hole for the tang. I assume that a guard that is forge welded togther is made pretty much like an axe head: the separate pieces are pre-shaped with a rather high degree of precision so that most of the hole is already shaped in the two halves. The welding process will distort this a little, so a tool is used to do final shaping after welding. This is the smae procedure you follow when you make a typical viking axe, where a butterfly shaped plate is shapd inot the eye and forge welded to the body of the blade. The edge and sometimes the neck reinforcement are then welded on afterwards. There is still a lot of shaping to do after forge welding. You cannot do this wothout a set of tools shaped specifically fo the task. Thse tools are essential for any smith: each product will ned a set of specially made tools that allows precise shaping of the parts. The craft of the smith includes the making of these tools: it is half the work. The more you froge to shape, the higher demand of fit and precision there is, the more specific tools you need: drifts, punches, fullering tools and swages.
A balde smith anvil was up till moder times a large block of steel with dove tail cuts in the upper surface: in these were affixed a number of special dies that allowed for precise forging of various cross sections. The master held the fullering tool or set hammers, while the helper (helpers) struck with the sledge hammer.
It is not always the case that old methods are less advanced than the methods we typically use today.

[Nick Trueman]

This would be a nice example

Nick

[Fabrice Cognot]

Thanks Peter


Your words are consistant with my observations (from period swords and other sources) and thoughts - I had no time to experiment with that however ...yet

French blade/blacksmith Tristian Esnault specifically forges "shouldered" chisels the same dimensions as the sword's shoulders and tang - hot punching/cutting through iron or mild steel is easy enough.

From what I've seen on period swords, this is probably how the thing was done (or something similiar), the chisel/punch obviously being available for later uses. The idea is to get the best fit on the tang - it matters less if the blade slot is too wide - thus one specific chisel/punch can be used on other crosses.



Thoguh I'd be interested in your take on pommels...

[Bruno Giordan]