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Michal Plezia
Industry Professional
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 Posted: Thu 18 Jan, 2007 7:25 am Post subject: Matchlock guns XV century |
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Hi!
I need contact to manufacturers who can make matchlock hangunn fron the 1450-1470 period.I prefer someone from Cenrtal and Eastern Europe...
I also need some pictures of originals and copys of such guns.
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www.elchon.com
Polish Guild of Knifemakers
The sword is a weapon for killing, the art of the sword is the art of killing. No matter what fancy words you use or what titles you put to
it that is the only truth.
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Richard Fay
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| Posted: Thu 18 Jan, 2007 9:20 am Post subject: |
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Hello all!
Michal,
Have you tried here:
http://www.historicenterprises.com/cart.php?m...3&c=24
They might have what you're looking for. At least the pictures are nice!
And this site has an interesting essay of the history of firearms up to 1500, with many pictures. The pictures are small, but they might be helpful (it has lots of links, too):
http://homepages.tig.com.au/~dispater/handgonnes.htm
I hope this helped!
Stay safe!
"I'm going to do what the warriors of old did! I'm going to recite poetry!"
Prince Andrew of Armar
Last edited by Richard Fay on Thu 18 Jan, 2007 9:48 am; edited 2 times in total
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Richard Fay
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| Posted: Thu 18 Jan, 2007 9:36 am Post subject: |
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Hello again!
I've found these pictures of a richly decorated matchlock carbine of circa 1490 on a gun-show site. I personally like the dragon motif; it looks like a fantasy piece, but it's historic.
Enjoy!
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Lock of matchlock carbine circa 1490.
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Muzzle of matchlock carbine circa 1490.
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Detail of breech of matchlock carbine circa 1490.
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Matchlock carbine circa 1490 (top).
"I'm going to do what the warriors of old did! I'm going to recite poetry!"
Prince Andrew of Armar
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Michal Plezia
Industry Professional
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| Posted: Thu 18 Jan, 2007 11:53 am Post subject: |
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 That 'dragon-gun' is wonderfull.Thanks for sharing!
www.elchon.com
Polish Guild of Knifemakers
The sword is a weapon for killing, the art of the sword is the art of killing. No matter what fancy words you use or what titles you put to
it that is the only truth.
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Randall Moffett
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| Posted: Thu 18 Jan, 2007 11:54 am Post subject: |
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Richard,
What gunshow was it? I have never seen a firearm from that era that looks like that. I agree the dragon motiff is very cool.
RPM
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Nathan Robinson
myArmoury Admin
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Richard Fay
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| Posted: Thu 18 Jan, 2007 12:26 pm Post subject: |
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| Nathan Robinson wrote: | | It's stamped "1900" -- perhaps it's supposed to be "in the style of" 1490? |
That's actually supposed to be a roughly-hewn "1490" - at least according to the web site. I'll have to find the website again and list a link.
Okay, I found the site. It's the Utah Gun Collectors Association October 2001 Gun Show. The short description of the matchlock definitely gives it a date of 1490. I think it's unclear in the photo; there's a bit of glare.
Here's the link:
http://www.ugca.org/ugca1001/ugca1001main.htm
I hope this helped!
"I'm going to do what the warriors of old did! I'm going to recite poetry!"
Prince Andrew of Armar
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Nathan Robinson
myArmoury Admin
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| Posted: Thu 18 Jan, 2007 12:30 pm Post subject: |
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| Richard Fay wrote: | | That's actually supposed to be a roughly-hewn "1490" - at least according to the web site. I'll have to find the website again and list a link. |
Gotcha. I can see it now. I still wonder of its age but you can only report what you've read in these instances so we're stuck with that until we can fire it. Er. Examine it. 
.:. Visit my Collection Gallery :: View my Reading List :: View my Wish List :: See Pages I Like :: Find me on Facebook .:.
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Michael Mercier
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| Posted: Thu 18 Jan, 2007 1:24 pm Post subject: |
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I didn't know they were using matchlocks in the 1400's. I thought they came about in the 1500's. I am currently making a functional replica gun and will attempt to start a new thread and post pictures tonight.
Mike
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Gordon Frye
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| Posted: Thu 18 Jan, 2007 7:59 pm Post subject: |
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Although the barrel of the matchlock in question may well date from 1490, the rest of it definitely does not. The lock style (especially with the trigger mechanism and guard), and the stock style date it to the very late-16th/ early-17th Century at best. Interestingly enough, it looks to be some form of breechloader, which is definitely cool. Rather akin to Henry VIII's breech loading arquebuses from the 1540's. (Of course it's those other firearms on the table there at the gunshow that really get ME excited.  )
For a European maker of fine matchlocks, wheellocks and other early firearms I would recommend this gentleman in Germany: http://www.engerisser.de/Bewaffnung/weapons/Firearms.html From what I have been able to gather, Herr König makes some wonderful firearms!
Here are a few sites to start with for more information on the different types of matchlocks that existed between 1400 and 1700:
http://homepages.ihug.com.au/~dispater/handgonnes.htm
http://www.geocities.com/Yosemite/Campground/8551/
I hope this helps!
Cheers!
Gordon
"After God, we owe our victory to our Horses"
Gonsalo Jimenez de Quesada
http://www.renaissancesoldier.com/
http://historypundit.blogspot.com/
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Randall Moffett
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| Posted: Fri 19 Jan, 2007 4:56 am Post subject: |
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It looked sort of like a 1790 perhaps instead of 1490 but I was not sure. Thanks for the link. Whatever the date it is interesting and very nice.
RPM
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Michal Plezia
Industry Professional
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| Posted: Fri 19 Jan, 2007 6:11 am Post subject: |
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Thanks for your help gentlemen
www.elchon.com
Polish Guild of Knifemakers
The sword is a weapon for killing, the art of the sword is the art of killing. No matter what fancy words you use or what titles you put to
it that is the only truth.
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Lin Robinson
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| Posted: Fri 19 Jan, 2007 2:27 pm Post subject: |
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| Gordon Frye wrote: | Although the barrel of the matchlock in question may well date from 1490, the rest of it definitely does not. The lock style (especially with the trigger mechanism and guard), and the stock style date it to the very late-16th/ early-17th Century at best. Interestingly enough, it looks to be some form of breechloader, which is definitely cool. Rather akin to Henry VIII's breech loading arquebuses from the 1540's. (Of course it's those other firearms on the table there at the gunshow that really get ME excited. )
For a European maker of fine matchlocks, wheellocks and other early firearms I would recommend this gentleman in Germany: http://www.engerisser.de/Bewaffnung/weapons/Firearms.html From what I have been able to gather, Herr König makes some wonderful firearms!
Here are a few sites to start with for more information on the different types of matchlocks that existed between 1400 and 1700:
http://homepages.ihug.com.au/~dispater/handgonnes.htm
http://www.geocities.com/Yosemite/Campground/8551/
I hope this helps!
Cheers!
Gordon |
I agree with Gordon. Whatever the age of the barrel, the stock, probably the lock and definitely the trigger mechanism date much later than 1490. However, I am also skeptical about the barrel. I certainly have not seen every matchlock ever made, and they were made in an almost infinite variety, but this one doesn't look like a 15th c. piece to me. To start with it is too clunky and awfully short. The early matchlock guns were nearly all equipped with heavy barrels, long or short, necessitating a prop to rest the gun on when shooting. The dragon, while interesting, is very impractical in terms of loading and would be easily damaged. And, the quality of construction doesn't appear to be there. In short, I just don't think it dates much further back than the 20th century.
During the 60s, when Dixie Gun Works ignited an interest in muzzle loading guns in the US, makers rushed to fill the needs of American shooters. A lot of exotic replicas were made, including some copies of fine European guns. I happened to have had my hands on one of these types of guns about five years ago. A gentleman who was a customer of the company I worked for at the time brought a very old-looking flintlock pistol by my office one afternoon. I looked it over and thought it was an antique that had been overly cleaned. He asked if I could take it to someone who could evaluate it for him. As it happened I was going to a gun show in Charlotte, NC the next day and a friend of mine, who has been in the antique gun business for a number of years, was going to be there. When I got there with the gun, two guys stopped me going in the door and looked the piece over, telling me it was definitely early 18th c., probably Italian, etc. When I got to my friend's table he took a look at it and got another fellow over who had written a couple of books on these things. That's when I learned, after we removed the lock and barrel, that it was a modern-made replica that had been "antiqued". Interestingly the maker, whoever he/she was, had constructed the frizzen with a series of vertical grooves in the face. I had found a photo of an Italian-made revolving gun with vertical grooves in the frizzen in one of my reference books prior to taking the gun to the show. That one feature, which I considered to be so obscure that it would not be copied by a modern builder, had convinced me that the gun was an antique. Quite a lesson to be learned.
I am probably completely wrong, but I think the matchlock is a relatively modern piece. It is certainly difficult to tell too much about it because of the lack of quality in the photos. Incidentally, matchlocks were first used around 1400.
Lin Robinson
"The best thing in life is to crush your enemies, see them driven before you and hear the lamentation of their women." Conan the Barbarian, 1982
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Michal Plezia
Industry Professional
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| Posted: Fri 19 Jan, 2007 3:38 pm Post subject: |
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http://www.historicenterprises.com/cart.php?m...3&c=24 they say their gun was made by a eastern europe manufacturer...any idea who can it be?It would be probably much cheaper to buy it directly there(not to mention shipping costs)
www.elchon.com
Polish Guild of Knifemakers
The sword is a weapon for killing, the art of the sword is the art of killing. No matter what fancy words you use or what titles you put to
it that is the only truth.
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