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Michael Moss
Location: Barcelona Joined: 11 May 2005
Posts: 18
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 Posted: Sun 23 Oct, 2005 12:21 pm Post subject: Cutting down a blade |
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Hello,
I'm just about to cut down a standard foil blade to 30 inches in order to make myself an 18th century-style foil suitable for Angelo-style fencing, but I'm afraid I'm absolutely ignorant on the topic of how to cut down a blade in what concerns safety and efficiency. Do I just saw it down, and file the tip to a rounded point? Is there anything in particular to be observed?
Thank you in advance,
Your humble servant,
To command,
Von Moss
La Garde meurt, mais ne se rend pas!
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Sean Flynt
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Jim Mearkle
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| Posted: Mon 24 Oct, 2005 6:34 pm Post subject: |
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American Fencing Supply sells 30 and 32 inch epee blades. http://www.amfence.com/html/childrens.html
Why not buy one and forgo the cutting? Your opponents will thank you, since a cut-down blade will be stiffer than the original. Ask for a "number zero" or a "children's epee." I had one for a while, and thought it great fun.
Also, without the "nailhead" end, you'll have to be very careful that the cut-down blade doesn't cut through the tip, leading to a potentially dangerous condition. You could thread the end for an electric dummy point, but that will add weight at the tip. Not much, but enough to be noticeable.
Jim
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Michael Moss
Location: Barcelona Joined: 11 May 2005
Posts: 18
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| Posted: Tue 25 Oct, 2005 5:32 am Post subject: |
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Thanks for the advice. I think maybe I'll just save myself the trouble, then, and go for one of those children's foils.
Cheers,
Von Moss
La Garde meurt, mais ne se rend pas!
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Bill Grandy
myArmoury Team
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| Posted: Tue 25 Oct, 2005 6:57 am Post subject: |
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I know Maestro Martinez a while back said he was experimenting with the children's blades. I never heard what his opinion was of them, but I've been meaning to check them out as smallsword blades myself.
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Chris Holzman
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| Posted: Tue 25 Oct, 2005 9:40 am Post subject: |
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| Bill Grandy wrote: | | I know Maestro Martinez a while back said he was experimenting with the children's blades. I never heard what his opinion was of them, but I've been meaning to check them out as smallsword blades myself. |
Bill,
I don't even like children's blades for children. They're simply not stiff or durable enough in my opinion, to give a realistic sense of foil fencing, let alone be used as a smallsword simulator.
A cut down stiff foil blade is probably far better in that respect - but as Sean Flynt pointed out above, peening the tip is probably a good idea, indeed, is certainly a good idea.
With the kids in our club, the 30" blades are super soft, whippy, etc, and kink badly. I've used them for giving lessons to the kids off and on, and they just feel horribly floppy to me.
Chris Holzman
River City Fencing Club
Wichita, KS
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Bill Grandy
myArmoury Team
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| Posted: Tue 25 Oct, 2005 12:27 pm Post subject: |
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Thanks Chris, that's good to know. Is this for both foil and epee blades, or just foil blades?
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Chris Holzman
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| Posted: Tue 25 Oct, 2005 2:39 pm Post subject: |
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| Bill Grandy wrote: | | Thanks Chris, that's good to know. Is this for both foil and epee blades, or just foil blades? |
Bill,
I despise the 30" foil blades - every one I have handled has had roughly the stiffness of a piece of overcooked spaghetti. I really don't like the 32" epees all that much either, but the ones i've handled are slightly stiffer than a 30" foil... but not by much. Same with the 30" sabre blades - yuck.
I think the big problem is that the manufacturers don't take those blades seriously, and they're generally at the absolute bottom of the quality scale.
The only top shelf maker that I know makes #2 epee blades is Prieur, and I haven't handled any of their stuff since they came back from the dead a few years ago. Prieur and BF sell #2 foil blades. StM also sells #2 epee blades.. Their #5's look a lot like a BF blade, but are softer.
There is simply no such thing as an FIE blade in #0 or #2 length, which, frankly is where a person needs to go these days, if they want a stiff blade, even in the #5 length, and then they still need to ask for the stiffest of the batch.
The big thing with the 30 and 32's are that they really are proportioned for children, and they work sort of ok for them, in that they can hold them on guard for 30 seconds at a time without the weight of the blade killing their arms. Beyond that..their utility is rather limited in my opinion.
Chris
Chris Holzman
River City Fencing Club
Wichita, KS
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Bill Grandy
myArmoury Team
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| Posted: Tue 25 Oct, 2005 2:47 pm Post subject: |
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| Chris Holzman wrote: | The big thing with the 30 and 32's are that they really are proportioned for children, and they work sort of ok for them, in that they can hold them on guard for 30 seconds at a time without the weight of the blade killing their arms. Beyond that..their utility is rather limited in my opinion.
Chris |
That's really good to know, Chris. Thanks. Yeah, at our academy we just use the standard #5 foils for kids, except in the very rare situation we have a very, very young student. In those cases they're just private lessons, and perfect form isn't even really a consideration (when they can barely walk straight.  ), so we use these bendy plastic foils for them. At least they can hold them for longer than a minute.
Guess I won't be picking up any of these shorter blades after all. That's okay, I'm not a dedicated smallsword person, I just like to dabble with it.
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Jim Mearkle
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| Posted: Tue 25 Oct, 2005 3:18 pm Post subject: |
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I must admit my #0 epee is several years old, and therefore may differ from those produced today. Also, one blade isn't exactly a representative sample.
That being said, I haven't had any problems with stiffness. I've parried double-wides with it. On the other hand, I do agree that #0 foils approach the stiffness of al dente linguini.
Upsetting the end of a cut down foil may be easier said than done. Blades vary quite a bit in hardness. Some may need to be heated, which could easily ruin the heat-treatment of the blade if you're not careful.
Jim
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Chris Holzman
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| Posted: Tue 25 Oct, 2005 5:06 pm Post subject: |
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| Jim Mearkle wrote: | I must admit my #0 epee is several years old, and therefore may differ from those produced today. Also, one blade isn't exactly a representative sample.
That being said, I haven't had any problems with stiffness. I've parried double-wides with it. On the other hand, I do agree that #0 foils approach the stiffness of al dente linguini.
Upsetting the end of a cut down foil may be easier said than done. Blades vary quite a bit in hardness. Some may need to be heated, which could easily ruin the heat-treatment of the blade if you're not careful. |
I can't think of anyone producing 30 epees... who made that blade?
Chris Holzman
River City Fencing Club
Wichita, KS
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Mark Eskra
Location: Hillsboro Illinois Joined: 14 Jun 2006
Posts: 37
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| Posted: Wed 14 Jun, 2006 2:53 pm Post subject: bent |
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roll the tip in a vise, then tap(pound) flat with a pain hammer-even rounded tips react like icepics, with the entire force of a thrust focused on the end. You can slightly soften with a propane torch; fold over more than u actually need, then trim and re-temper
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