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Jonathan Hodge




Location: East Tennessee
Joined: 18 Sep 2015

Posts: 110

PostPosted: Tue 29 Aug, 2017 5:44 pm    Post subject: Good Source for Proper Mail         Reply with quote

Has anyone had recent experience getting a historically accurate mail hauberk (around 1200-1225ish)? I've perused the threads on this topic but most aren't exactly current. I'm looking to begin building a 13th century kit that may be able to use the mail for other related kits.
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Mart Shearer




Location: Jackson, MS, USA
Joined: 18 Aug 2012

Posts: 1,263

PostPosted: Tue 29 Aug, 2017 6:23 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Historical accuracy is a sliding measurement. Is the wire made from streaky steel or wrought iron with silica stringers? Is the size and shape of the ring accurate? And the list can go on...

Even worse, what extant mail can we date to that period to use as a metric for comparison?

ferrum ferro acuitur et homo exacuit faciem amici sui
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Dan Howard




Location: Maitland, NSW, Australia
Joined: 08 Dec 2004

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PostPosted: Tue 29 Aug, 2017 6:49 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Yep. The best we can do is select a specific museum example and try to make the replica as close as possible. That means having an example from which to take measurements and metallurgical analyses.
Author: Bronze Age Military Equipment, Pen and Sword Books
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Arne G.





Joined: 31 Jul 2014

Posts: 51

PostPosted: Tue 29 Aug, 2017 6:53 pm    Post subject: Re: Good Source for Proper Mail         Reply with quote

Jonathan Hodge wrote:
Has anyone had recent experience getting a historically accurate mail hauberk (around 1200-1225ish)? I've perused the threads on this topic but most aren't exactly current. I'm looking to begin building a 13th century kit that may be able to use the mail for other related kits.


Your only "source" is to make it yourself, really. Doable, mind you, but labor intensive.
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Mark Moore




Location: East backwoods-assed Texas
Joined: 01 Oct 2003
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PostPosted: Tue 29 Aug, 2017 7:18 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

This day and age, you are pretty much left with three choices--Buy India-made mail, buy custom made mail($$$$), or buy rings and make it yourself as you see fit. I bought my haubergeon and coif from KOA, made by Lord of Battles, and I'm perfectly happy with it. Fits like a second skin, especially now that I have edged the sleeves of the shirt and the face of the coif with leather and lacing to be able to draw them up a bit. Happy ....McM
''Life is like a box of chocolates...'' --- F. Gump
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Jonathan Hodge




Location: East Tennessee
Joined: 18 Sep 2015

Posts: 110

PostPosted: Tue 29 Aug, 2017 7:31 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Thanks all. Dan, you bring up an excellent point and one I've considered; recognizing that these variables are even more compounded by location - i.e. Scandinavia versus continent, etc. ad infinitum. Ultimately, I'm looking for mail that could be considered accurate for some key markers that seem to be shared by extant fragments and sources of the period (and as far as mail is concerned, even carried over form earlier eras). Two of the most important being the alternating rows of riveted and solid rings, and a four-in-one pattern.

I recognize that doing it on my own is the best method...but I'm wary of the amount of skill necessary to produce the necessary pattern.

Dan, your article here on mail was very instrumental in my desire to begin a harness of this time period. Thanks for your scholarship.
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Peter Spätling
Industry Professional



Location: Germany
Joined: 07 Nov 2015

Posts: 117

PostPosted: Tue 29 Aug, 2017 9:20 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

I'd get in touch with Isak Krogh. I've never seen better maille than the one he makes himself. For customer he takes Indian maille and reworks it entirely to fit the customer. And he 's cheap since he 's new in the business. I'll get some stuff from him as well ^^
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Luka Borscak




Location: Croatia
Joined: 11 Jun 2007
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PostPosted: Wed 30 Aug, 2017 8:07 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

There are several good Polish makers. https://www.facebook.com/loricator/
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Harry Marinakis




Location: Kingdom of Æthelmearc
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PostPosted: Sat 02 Sep, 2017 5:05 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Take a look at AllBestStuff
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Jonathan Hodge




Location: East Tennessee
Joined: 18 Sep 2015

Posts: 110

PostPosted: Sat 02 Sep, 2017 6:24 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Thanks for the helpful info.

Last edited by Jonathan Hodge on Tue 05 Sep, 2017 12:18 pm; edited 1 time in total
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James Arlen Gillaspie
Industry Professional



Location: upstate NY
Joined: 10 Nov 2005

Posts: 523

PostPosted: Tue 05 Sep, 2017 11:53 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

There is very little mail that can be securely dated as coming from that time. I doubt flat link was in use, yet, but early wedge rivets might have been used. About certain that half the rings were still solid. The weight of the shirt might well be a lot heavier than later shirts. Check the 'heavy shirt' (37 lbs) posted on the 'Authentic Mail Pictures' thread. I believe it is the oldest armour I have worked on. It has few parallels, and I think it predates 1300 A.D. I wonder what Simon Metcalf would say.
http://myArmoury.com/talk/viewtopic.php?t=293...;start=460

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