La Tene Blades with a Curve -- myArmoury.com

Kirk Lee Spencer · Posted: Sun 23 Jan, 2005 12:16 pm Post subject: La Tene Blades with a Curve

Hi all...

JM Navarro published pictures of a couple of LaTene blades that were curved in his report on the finds at LaTene...
These curved LaTene swords look almost like a hybrid between the LaTene blade and the Falcata.
I thought they were probably interesting anomalies or either were bent during their stay underground.
(For instance with such a close fitting scabbard on a curved blade how would they ever extract the sword,
unless it opened up at a seam). However I have recently discovered what may be another curved LaTene blade
found in England (published on the Museum of London website). So I thought I would post the pictures
and see what you thought of them. If they were made with curved blades they are really quite graceful IMO.
And they certainly resonate with the Celt's love of curves.

ks

Greyson Brown · Posted: Sun 23 Jan, 2005 1:11 pm Post subject:

I sure hope that shape is intentional, 'cause I like it. I do not see any reason why a sword would change shape noticeably while buried. I think that it is more likely that, if that is not its original shape, that it was damaged/reshaped somehow during its working life. I agree that a scabbard for such swords could be awkward, but I think it could be done, especially since that sword has relatively shallow curves to it.

I have seen a few line drawings of swords with this general shape (there are several in Peter Conolly's Greece and Rome at War, in the section on pre-Roman italians), but I hadn't seen much archeological evidence up to this point. Thanks for the picture.

Any idea on the dimentions? It looks rather short.

-Grey

Kirk Lee Spencer · Posted: Sun 23 Jan, 2005 1:38 pm Post subject:

Greyson Brown · Posted: Sun 23 Jan, 2005 2:33 pm Post subject:

Kirk,

I feel kind of silly, I completely missed the measurements in the caption. Thanks for pointing that out.

Now that you comment on it, I can see that the sword is still in its scabbard. You are right that is a tight fit, but I still think the curve is shallow enough to draw the blade. There might be a slight downward rotation or angling of the hand as you draw the blade, but it should come out. Kukri scabbards are a bit bulkier, but the curve is also more exagerated, and I think this one would work in a similar manner. If it comes to it, a saber has a more noticeable curve, and while the uniformity that curve helps, it would not be too inconceivable to think that a saber could not be drawn (which I did think at one point in my youth), unless you knew better.

I admit, this is a rather weak argument, and I cannot claim to be anywhere near as knowledgeable on it as I would like to be.

-Grey

Russ Ellis · Industry Professional

If it wasn't corroded in there I bet it would slide right out. All it would take is a slightly wider throat to allow you to draw at a slight angle. You have the sword made and I'll do a scabbard to show you what I mean. Happy

Tom Carr · Posted: Sun 23 Jan, 2005 10:39 pm Post subject:

Thats different! Reminds me of a Yataghan blade. I dont think that scabbard would be too tight. The curve is very gentle and should slide in and out without difficulty. Very cool! Must be a local variant that had a short span of appeal, or just to expensive to make. Didnt some dutch knives have a similar shape? I recall some bronze pieces that had a gentle curve like these, but much smaller in scale.

B. Stark · Industry Professional

I'm wondering of these aren't "sacrificed" blades? Peter?...

Gary Grzybek · Posted: Mon 24 Jan, 2005 4:18 pm Post subject:

Kirk Lee Spencer · Posted: Mon 24 Jan, 2005 7:38 pm Post subject:

At first I thought they may be sacrificially bent or altered someway by burial pressures or differential corrosion (not very likely). But the curves are so beautiful and Celt-like.

Here are a few pictures of "sacrificed" LaTene swords I have on file.

ks

Nathan Bell · Posted: Tue 25 Jan, 2005 6:10 am Post subject:

Kirk Lee Spencer · Posted: Tue 25 Jan, 2005 2:46 pm Post subject:

Nathan Bell · Posted: Wed 26 Jan, 2005 1:41 pm Post subject:

Hi Kirk,

Yeah, it is a cool shape, just not one seen in celtic sword-length, I think. Not too far off some of the knives though.

And I also get the impression that these existed somewhere in antiquity as well after flipping back through my own Connolly (thanks Greyson). Maybe a variant of the sica?

What the shape and curve most reminds me of, though, is those fantasy type gigantic yataghan-ish sword-knives used in The Mummy II---now what does that tell you about my taste in movies though Worried

Were there any yataghan-type swords with a similar shape curve but large, beefy and double edged for much of their length?

Jean Thibodeau · Posted: Wed 26 Jan, 2005 2:05 pm Post subject:

Nathan;

Well I bought the Mummy sword "Kopesh" Scorpion King, nice display piece and frustrating that it would be a good sword if the steel blade was better quality and the "SUPER HEAVY" solid brass didn't make boat anchors seem light.

It is a great excercise tool: After a few minute of swinging it in the air my Gaddhjalt feels light as a feather ....... LOL.

A functionnal Kopesh should be the ultimate cleaver ! (Albion ....... HINT, HINT ..... Ancien sword line maybe in steel and / or Bronze.)

Greyson:
I too wish that this shape, the curved La Tene, is what the sword was intented to be, rather than an illusion caused by it being sacrificed : It looks very good in the picture.

Greyson Brown · Posted: Thu 27 Jan, 2005 3:03 am Post subject:

Kirk Lee Spencer · Posted: Thu 27 Jan, 2005 7:48 pm Post subject:

Kirk Lee Spencer · Posted: Sat 29 Jan, 2005 8:29 am Post subject: