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S White




Location: Australia
Joined: 04 Jun 2009
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PostPosted: Sun 12 Jan, 2014 1:12 pm    Post subject: Practical Vking Sword advice ...         Reply with quote

Greetings all,

I am seeking advice on a good practical Viking/Saxon styled sword for bouting and instruction. I am the armorer of my fencing school currently looking for recommendations on the best quality practical available up to a $300 price point. I would prefer the swords came with scabbards and it would be nice if the blades had some life and were not crow bars while also being tough as nails. I have previously bought practicals from Darkwood, but they do not make Viking style swords and their prices are a little high now for my purposes in supplying students with an affordable, tough and good looking blade.

Typically I have outright rejected Hanwei, Deepeeka and Windlass based on reputation but for anything other than being wall hangers - however, I have recently read some promising things about the Deepeeka Triple Lobed Viking blunts - though no reviews of their practical use have been forthcoming. Armour Class seem to be the next best affordable line in practical blunts though a little on the high end price wise, and they do not appear to come with a scabbard? Normally I wouldn't touch Deepeeka with a barge pole, but I am open to suggestions and have heard they are improving their quality control in exponential terms. The Armour Class practical Viking blades seem to have a very pronounced taper towards the point which doesn't appear particularly accurate in historical terms ... ???

So gents ... please tell me, based on my requirements and budget, what suggestions you might have for me?

Regards, Soren.
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Mark Moore




Location: East backwoods-assed Texas
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PostPosted: Sun 12 Jan, 2014 2:28 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

There is a topic here, somewhere, about the new Deepeeka Viking models. It shows the very robust tang. For the price, I'd try out a couple. I plan on getting their new-ish St. Maurice. Big Grin ...........McM
''Life is like a box of chocolates...'' --- F. Gump
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S White




Location: Australia
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PostPosted: Sun 12 Jan, 2014 2:39 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Thanks Mark ... for the price of the Deepeeka I am actually thinking of just buying a one off - (from KOA) - to test it to satisfy my own curiosity. I was hoping to get some hands on reports or reviews from people here who might have practical experience with them before I did so - though they look promising and I have seen the beefy tang on them from another thread somewhere which impressed me a great deal.

Soren.
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Jussi Ekholm




Location: Tampere, Finland
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PostPosted: Mon 13 Jan, 2014 7:31 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

I just recently bought 2 Deepeeka swords for bit similar reasons as you are thinking. They cost around 100 in Europe and come with scabbards (at least I thought so on both of them), of course I didn't have the combat aspect, I just wanted variation to my collection for affordable price.

After reading a bit of positive things about their new lineup, I decided to go for Hersir as I wanted type H viking sword. You can read my impressions on this thread: http://www.myArmoury.com/talk/viewtopic.php?t=29539

Honestly after holding them in my hands I'm not sure how battle worthy they are. I don't have much experince with sparring blunts, but these are not of very high quality.

The more I handle it the less I like it, the weight is killing me. And I would advice approaching them with caution. Sure they are cheap enough to try, but I really wish I would have saved the money I put in these 2 swords. Well now I know how I'll feel about Deepeeka products for the next 5 years or so.

Jussi Ekholm
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S White




Location: Australia
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PostPosted: Mon 13 Jan, 2014 7:48 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Jussi,

Thank you very much for your input my friend, your take on these blades is making me rethink my initial interest ... I certainly don't want anything that won't hold up and a basic standard of quality is something I expect and am willing to pay for. I am open to hearing from others on any and all brands to service my needs and budget ...

I had a look at the Tinker/Hanwei blunt which seems very well crafted, but I have no idea how they might stand up to bouting ... the pommel and hilt detailing look very nice if a little generic, but the finish and quality seem to be there.

Soren.
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Roger Hooper




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PostPosted: Mon 13 Jan, 2014 8:29 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Maybe you should investigate some of the Czech swordmakers. Fabri Armorum makes some blunt Viking swords - see them HERE at Kult of Athena. Sadly, I don't have direct experience with their stuff, but maybe someone else on this forum does, and will weigh in on their quality
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S White




Location: Australia
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PostPosted: Mon 13 Jan, 2014 8:40 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Roger,

Thanks mate, I did look at those at KOA but they look very crude to me and not very accurate in terms of blade geometry - they have a very clunky toy like appearance - I was looking for something that had all the looks of the genuine article, with a blunt blade ... it may be a tougher ask than I first imagined. Armour Class have a Saxon blunt that might be the best thing going for the price point I am looking at ...

Soren.
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Foong Chen Hong




Location: Malaysia
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PostPosted: Mon 13 Jan, 2014 8:50 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Try asking this one, you can have him make a custom practice swords for you

http://www.regenyei.sg18.net/en_onehanded.html

Though you need to give him a spec, he is well versed in blade geometry and he is specialized in making training sword. You can ask him to make stiffer sword or more flexible sword if you prefer.

Descanse En Paz
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Peter Messent




Location: Texas
Joined: 03 Jan 2009

Posts: 226

PostPosted: Mon 13 Jan, 2014 9:21 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

I have the deepeeka triple lobed godfred; it was over-heavy and generally messed up (I detailed its faults in a thread a while back) but mostly salvageable.

The Hersir is incomparable in terms of weight, from the figures I've read. My Triple lobed godfred (admittedly, after I cut the tip off) weighs 2lb 4oz (a little over 1kg) - there's no problem swinging it around. It has a very beefy tang, also. If I hadn't put a crude edge on it, I'd be more than happy to use it for reenacting.

That said, they are still of generally low quality - as you would expect for a $130 sword. Tbh they exceed my expectations for the price, though.

Regarding Hanwei, I had a practical viking a few years ago; this was back before I knew anything about swords, so I would bash it off everything (including lots of edge-on-edge contact with other swords) and it held up great - if I were to go reenact, I'd probably consider it again.
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Lee O'Hagan




Location: Northamptonshire,England
Joined: 30 Sep 2003
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PostPosted: Mon 13 Jan, 2014 2:28 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Hi Soren,
If your thinking of importing, post and tax,Sad
why not factor that cost onto an OZ based maker and see if they can be of help,
Fableblades would be worth an ask at least, cant speak for him, but worth doing the math and making a call or sending a mail,Wink
Armour class are a good outfit, no doubt they can adjust things to suit you,
if your looking at post from the UK,
also look at St George Armoury, Paul Binns, Tim Noyes,
The Hanwei Tinker swords have a reasonable rep from past reading, whether they do a Viking model, I don't know,?
but the search engine here will be of assistance,
Best of luck with the search, Happy
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S White




Location: Australia
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PostPosted: Mon 13 Jan, 2014 2:52 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Foong,

Thanks for suggesting Peter, I know his work but again, he does not produce a Viking sword - not to say he could not custom make one for me, but I am trying keep costs down for the purpose of supplying students and a custom item may not fit that bill budget wise. I will talk to him though but as others have said ... add shipping which is about +$60 USD to any item from the U.S and goodness knows what from Europe ... hmmm the costs climbs.

Peter.

Thanks for your input and review .,.. it was your 3 lobed Deepeka that gave me initial hope but it seems these may be more beater than serviceable bouting blades when push comes to shove!


Lee.

Great idea to go local, manning Imperial make some lovely stuff but the prices are in the stratosphere and I suspect Phil is not really interested in making serviceable bouting blunts at low cost, his market seems to be up there price wise. As for Fable, I have previously avoided because I am not a Fantasy guy at all, pure history is my game so I was a little put off by the sheer volume of whacky TV and Sci Fi stuff I saw there. However, on second look he does a Neo Historical line and the workmanship is nothing short of exceptional ... if I can get him to tone it down for a practical blunt, we might have a winner but again, it will all come down to cost at the end of the day.

I'll shoot Fable an e-mail because shipping from O/S is +$60 on any item from the U.S as stated above so if I can roll some of that expense into local product, that makes better sense over all ... however Fable seems to do one of a kind commission work that is quoted up to $3000 AUD an item ... can't really see Fable doing any sub $300 bouting blunts either ... sheesh.

Soren.
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Steven Janus




Location: Florida, USA
Joined: 12 Mar 2008

Posts: 185

PostPosted: Mon 13 Jan, 2014 4:40 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Roger Hooper wrote:
Maybe you should investigate some of the Czech swordmakers. Fabri Armorum makes some blunt Viking swords - see them HERE at Kult of Athena. Sadly, I don't have direct experience with their stuff, but maybe someone else on this forum does, and will weigh in on their quality


I was right about to mention Fabri Armorum as I own a few. The only thing I don't like about them is the cross guard is a press fit. Their cross guard usually come loose at some point in time. Every one of their swords I ended up rewraping the grip. Their blades are fantastic and hold up well in combat, fittings do too but not as well. They are great weapons, but need a little help the way they come.

Newbie Sword collector
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Peter Messent




Location: Texas
Joined: 03 Jan 2009

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PostPosted: Mon 13 Jan, 2014 6:00 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

S White wrote:
Peter.

Thanks for your input and review .,.. it was your 3 lobed Deepeka that gave me initial hope but it seems these may be more beater than serviceable bouting blades when push comes to shove!

Indeed; it is good that their work is improving, but unfortunate that it has not come further, and that they are still turning out the sharpened I-beam model of sword. I suppose that I got lucky in which model I purchased, and that perhaps gave me more hope than was due!
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Evan Wilson




Location: Texas
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PostPosted: Tue 14 Jan, 2014 12:33 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

If you're wanting a blunt that looks good, functions well, and is cheap, I'm afraid you're going to lose in at least one of those categories.

Honestly the Fabri is your best bet. It may not look good, but they are durable and handle very well. Keep in mind Fabri has three types of blades and the standard blade is the only one stoked on KOA.

Stay far, far, away from Deepeka. Their blades are not good quality and can snap while sparring.

I have heard good reviews on Armor Class Swords, but no one in my group owns one.

If you are really focused on the look, you can not go wrong with an Albion. My group owns several Albion swords from both the maestro and the skirmish lines.

Baltimore Knife and Sword is also a reputable blunt maker, but as with Albion the price is high. You do get lifetime warranties with both BKS and Albion, while with the others you will have only a 1-2 year warranty if any.

Semper Vigilantis et Fidelis
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Roger Hooper




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PostPosted: Tue 14 Jan, 2014 1:15 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Evan Wilson wrote:
If you're wanting a blunt that looks good, functions well, and is cheap, I'm afraid you're going to lose in at least one of those categories.


He's right about that. For $300.00, you will have to make compromises on quality. You certainly won't get a scabbard included with a decent sword.

I believe Baltimore Knife and Sword doesn't make a blunt Viking.

Albion Skirmish Line Vikings would be great, but cost around $600.00. The Albion Squire Line Viking is a very good sword at $473.00. I don't think it's blunt enough, but you could ask Albion to fix that.

The Hanwei/Tinker blunt Viking sword would have bee good for you, but they have been discontinued.

The Hanwei Practical Viking actually includes a cheapo scabbard. Why have you disqualified that model? It isn't that great, but it might be the best in your price range - At Therion
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Robin Smith




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PostPosted: Tue 14 Jan, 2014 2:09 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Evan Wilson wrote:
If you're wanting a blunt that looks good, functions well, and is cheap, I'm afraid you're going to lose in at least one of those categories.

I think this is probably a universal truth.

Aesthetics, Function, Cheapness.... Pick any two

A furore Normannorum libera nos, Domine
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Evan Wilson




Location: Texas
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PostPosted: Tue 14 Jan, 2014 5:14 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

[quote="Roger Hooper"]
Evan Wilson wrote:

I believe Baltimore Knife and Sword doesn't make a blunt Viking.
[/url]

Here it is.

Semper Vigilantis et Fidelis
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Roger Hooper




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PostPosted: Tue 14 Jan, 2014 5:34 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Evan Wilson wrote:

Here it is.


Glad to be wrong, but $600.00 for a blunt with no distal taper, weighing around 3.5 lbs (and no scabbard) - seems a little steep to me.
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Evan Wilson




Location: Texas
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PostPosted: Tue 14 Jan, 2014 5:46 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Roger Hooper wrote:
Evan Wilson wrote:

Here it is.


Glad to be wrong, but $600.00 for a blunt with no distal taper, weighing around 3.5 lbs (and no scabbard) - seems a little steep to me.


Yeah I think so too, but I thought I should include it in the list nonetheless.

Semper Vigilantis et Fidelis
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S White




Location: Australia
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PostPosted: Tue 14 Jan, 2014 7:32 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Percentages of students who stick to any activity is around 20% out of a 100% ... most people new to HEMA will be a tough sell on an initial outlay purchase of $600 ... especially when there are items of protective clothing to be bought into the bargain. Personally I would not pay $600 for blunt ... much rather put that money towards a good quality sharp. If I were hunting just for myself the question would not require the asking ... but I asked because I had explored all my usual options trying to meet the goal of a good quality blunt for sub $300 which is still a lot of money for a beginner. It really does appear that the Armour Class blunts are the best deal going ... sans scabbard.

Soren.
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