[Baymon Timon]

Hello.

I acquired a helmet from a antiques auction and wanted to know where this helmet originates from or how old it is? Any feedback would be great. I am a newbie to antiques and looking to educate myself here with experienced people. I have had this piece for over a year now. The chain is starting to rust slowly probably due to its age, the interior has been padded with a later added cloth. The person I got it from on auction was a antiques arms dealer in the states. It seems to be in good condition but It is hard to tell where it originates from, it's value or how old it is. Any help would be appreciated! Also the nasal guard works and has it's functionality but a little rusty.

I have attached images here.

[R. Kolick]

Im not an expert and i could be wrong but it’s at the youngest it’s an early Saracen helm from maybe the first or second crusade. The thing that makes me think that is the nasal guard, I’ve only seen them on early helms from the middle east. but they had extensive trade routes throughout the middle east and into china so it could have been used or made in any of the countries that are now Israel, Iran, Iraq, Saudi Arabia, or Jordan

[Matthew Bunker]

Based on examples I've seen in the Wallace and Royal Armouries, early modern (ie 17th-19th century) century Persian.

[Gregory J. Liebau]

*Most Likely* a Quajar Dynasty era helmet (c. 1785-1925), probably from the early-mid 19th century. Here are some other examples of the style.

http://www.peterpetrou.com/persian-helmet-and-shield/

http://www.flickr.com/photos/kitonlove/4662201926/

http://www.oriental-arms.com/item.php?id=2257

http://www.goantiques.com/scripts/images,id,2331524.html

Cheers.

-Gregory

(EDIT: I hate using absolutes. This is not "definitely" anything!)

[Baymon Timon]

[Allan Senefelder]

[Daniel Sullivan]

Am inclined to chime in with Allan. By all means seek authentication. There is a lot of "new" stuff on the market, some of it pretty authentic looking and some not so great.

I am not an expert, but do have two helmets of this type for comparison. A couple of things drew my attention, one being that the gold looks like paint vs. wire hammered into chasing (a common though not the only method used). And the rust has a red tint, with any age the oxidation is very dark...usually black.

Please keep us posted on your research..

Regards,
Dan

[Jean-Carle Hudon]

Hi,
a local jeweller should be able to tell you if you have any gold leaf, as opposed to paint, on that helm. At first glance, with the photos, I tend to agree with Daniel that it looks more like paint. Also the mail seems modern, much too big in circumference to be of any use to a nineteenth century warrior. The three first pics posted by Gregory show a tighter weave, the fourth is less so, but still smaller than the one you are investigating. I also think that authentication is the way to go.

[Allan Senefelder]

[Jean-Carle Hudon]

Thanks Allan, I will defer to your experience in this matter. I have seen things like this in different ''antique'' stores in
Montreal, more and more of these pieces pop up as our immigration attracts more incoming permanent residents from
India, Iran, Afghanistan and Pakistan. The mail, though rusted, looks roughly like the stuff I used to do for my SCA costumes, so I have ever been wary about provenance as the dealers don't seem to know themselves. Thanks for the input.

[Allan Senefelder]

[Baymon Timon]

I will go to a local jeweler and see if they can identify that as having gold work. Will post updates.

The circumference where they head goes in between the chain mail is actually very small, so whoever wore it, must have had a very small head. Nevertheless, it is a great piece of art, even if it is not an antique. It looks fabulous on display, especially if you add two ostrich plume feathers onto it!

[Nadeem Ahmad]

I think it is more Indian than Persian - Persian helmets had very deep, hemi-spherical bowls, whereas Indian ones were flatter. Although, it is a little hard to tell on this piece, it seem somewhere in between the two extremes!

The screw for the nasal also looks odd to me. The screws are usually flattened vertically so you can grip it (does this make sense?), whereas this is more of a knob.

The decoration looks a fair bit coarser than any earlier helmets, I would think it was rather made for a foreign collector rather than for an actual Indian / Persian who wanted to wear it to fight, quite late (late 19th C?). The style of decoration is also a little unlike ones I've seen, and several of the "vowel marks" on the writing are placed in an odd way, and the way the letters are formed looks a little odd too. Of course, it could simply have been made by a less literate armourer ...?

Although, I may be suffering from sampling bias

[Rob Phillips]

[Bennison N]

That's a beautiful helmet.

Very nice find and score, mate!