[Scott Hrouda]

Recently there have been several very informative threads regarding mail which have got my creative juices flowing.

Here’s my situation: I’m working on a mid-14th century English kit and I really want to create a period correct standing mail collar with the little tiny rings. (Hours and hours of fun! )

Here’s the dilemma: I fight in the SCA which requires rigid neck, throat and vertebra protection. (Bummer )

Here’s the compromise: Create a form-fitting (and admittedly anachronistic) gorget, then hide it by attaching the standing mail collar.

Here’s the request: Has anyone done this before? What is the best way to go about this project? Does anyone have a better or more historically accurate alternative?

[Sander Marechal]

Why attach it? Could you not simply wear a maille standard over a leather (or leather-covered steel) standard or low profile gorget? Since you're making it yourself, you can make sure it snugly fits over it without wiggle room. That way when you're not doing any SCA fighting you can simply leave out the under collar/gorget and just wear the period appropriate maille standard.

[Scott Hrouda]

[Sander Marechal]

Unfortunately not. I'm currently focusing on a 1250-ish kit and if I recall correctly, mail collars are more of a late 14th century thing. I'd love to have a decent 14th century kit some day, buy a lack of money means I need to get my 1250-ish kit done first (my reenactment club has got it's first public performance this October).

[Chuck Russell]

are standards a 14thc thing? i thought they were more of a mid-late 15thc thing.

i have seen SCA fighters use a standard with their rigs before. heavy weight leather and padding attached to the top of the standard that goes around the neck. the mail itself will make it stand up.

as seen here: all it has is a thin leather liner to protect my neck.

[Scott Hrouda]

I'm under the assumption that standing mail collars can be dated to the 14th century. Some nice pictorial references were provided by Elling Polden in the What did a mail coif really look and work like? thread.

I'd be very interested to know if the 14th century is too early to reliably document.

[David Teague]

Hi Scott,

I've been busy so I've haven't had the time to reply.

I've "made" padded maille standards from pre-made riveted standards sold by both Historic Enterprise and Icefalcon Armory. HE is suppose to be stocking a 7 mm ring version soon and Ice brings in a 6mm ring model.

My first one has a fitted "dog collar" made from 2 layers of heavy 10 oz veg tanned curiboiled leather with a 16 ga trauma plate that was sewn on to the padded linen shell.

My newest versions forgos the dog collar for a padded floating 16 ga trauma plate held in place by a buckskin cover as that's all we need in WMA. The basic shell has 3 layers of padding and the plate has 3 more.









Hope this gives you some ideas.

David

[Mackenzie Cosens]

[Scott Hrouda]

[Bill Grandy]

The one David shows above he put together for me (because he is awesome!), and I have been raving about how much I love it. Its primary function is for WMA unarmored bouting, with it over my gamebeson and under my mask. It provides surprisingly good throat protection and also covers the collar bones, but is flexible enough that I can lift my arms straight up (can't do that with a brigandine gorget).

I'm also now using it with my 15th c. harness. The padding makes it too thick to fit under my cuirass, but it works quite well over it, as seen below.

[Nathan Robinson]

Men in armour who smile look strange to me.

[David Teague]

[Ben van Koert]

This is how I did it with my 9 mm maille standard:





When my 6 mm voider set arrives I won't pad it, but just use some leather to make the collar stand up. This 9 mm is too thick to be used with my bevors, but is ideal when used together with a barbute, as the extra neck protection is more welcome then.
The small pigskin edging makes a lot of difference in the comfort of the standard rubbing against your throat, I can recommend it.

[Chuck Russell]

http://www.historiclife.com/Armory.htm here's James Barkers standard as well as original pictures of one in museums

[Scott Hrouda]