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Jean de Buren




Location: California
Joined: 30 Nov 2009

Posts: 4

PostPosted: Thu 17 Dec, 2009 6:26 pm    Post subject: Sword Identifications         Reply with quote

Could you please help me identify the following period swords. I appreciate any help you can provide.

Thanks in advance,

Jean-François



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JF de Buren
http://threebeehives.blogspot.com/
http://vodhdb.blogspot.com/
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A. Spanjer




Location: USA
Joined: 26 Apr 2009

Posts: 242

PostPosted: Thu 17 Dec, 2009 8:19 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Do you mean sword types or individuals? Because the first looks like a side-sword the next two are sabres and the last looks like some sort of smallsword.
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Lukasz Papaj




Location: Malbork, Poland
Joined: 09 Mar 2009

Posts: 59

PostPosted: Fri 18 Dec, 2009 1:57 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Second Saber (third item): Hilt seems to be of late (possibly XIX century) variation of closed "Hussaresque" hilt (notice apparent lack of structural connection between guard and "pommel"). Lack of finger ring and stylisation make it quite late too.
There is overall design similarity to pattern 1921/22 military sabre , minus grip wrap and guard (strange slot design, maybe replacement fitted in later time?) , which in turn was based on earlier designs from before Napoleonic era.
Blade in turn seems to be very close to French 1822 Pattern sabre.
This item seems to have definite Polish influence. Lines are quite soft , I would be guessing civilian commission based on some historical piece- maybe a French blade rehilted in Polish-Romantic style by some exile.
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Sean Flynt
myArmoury Team


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Location: Birmingham, Alabama
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PostPosted: Fri 18 Dec, 2009 7:33 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

The first sword appears to be a German/Austrian or Italian weapon of ca. 1550 +/- 25 years. Could be a 19th c. piece or a late marriage of unrelated parts. The reeded grip is interesting and the blade is gorgeous, but possibly shortened/tapered. My guess is that the parts are all 16th c. Great quality overall.
-Sean

"Everywhere I have searched for peace and nowhere found it, except in a corner with a book"- Thomas a Kempis (d. 1471)
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Glen A Cleeton




Location: Nipmuc USA
Joined: 21 Aug 2003

Posts: 1,920

PostPosted: Fri 18 Dec, 2009 7:59 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

The last of the batch (with the knight head pommel) looks to be a French style officer sword with a spadroon blade likely of Solingen make. Timeline of the First Empire. I see these more often with the lighter dressy double edged foibles but this one has a sturdy fighting spadroon blade. Maybe meant for a French heavy cavalry officer parade type sword. I wish I knew the knot and if it is period. It is also very possible of being meant for another country but the hilt is French style, while the blade of Solingen origin.

The chunky slotted hilt hussar type is unknown to me as well but the fashion of slots runs post mid 18th century. There is a very interesting French made folding slotted hilt circulating and while probably off topic, was brought to mind by this hussar presented here.

The book plates were shared by Vincent here at myArmoury, I don't recall the title. Sorry, the last was saved as png and I don't remember why (click to download)

Cheers

GC



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Vincent Le Chevalier




Location: Paris, France
Joined: 07 Dec 2005
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PostPosted: Fri 18 Dec, 2009 8:58 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Glen A Cleeton wrote:

The book plates were shared by Vincent here at myArmoury, I don't recall the title.

The plates are from Les armes blanches : sabres et épées, by Dominique Venner, published by Jacques Grancher in 1986. I think the book is out of print now.

The last two look like hilt 113 in Norman's typology, and it has been used all over Europe since the middle of the XVIIIth century. Indeed they were heavily used by French officers. There is a similar example here. Apparently the name for this form is boat-shell, maybe it can help your search. The markings on the blades and hilts, if any, may provide more detailed information than the blade and hilt shape for these...

Regards,

--
Vincent
Ensis Sub Caelo
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Sean Flynt
myArmoury Team


myArmoury Team

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PostPosted: Fri 18 Dec, 2009 12:22 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Jean: For reference, here's a German sword of 1500-1525.


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-Sean

"Everywhere I have searched for peace and nowhere found it, except in a corner with a book"- Thomas a Kempis (d. 1471)
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