[Alain D.]

Does anybody know the history of the reenactment/weapon collecting hobby? I understand that most people did not have money to spend on such things until the 20th century, but it seems logical that there would have been historians in the past with the passion to pursue such a hobby. Victorian archery could be considered a historical example, as well as fencing. Are there any other documented examples of people pursuing such hobbies in the past? There certainly wouldn't have been reproductions widely available on the market until modern times to support the community of today.

-Alain

[Chad Arnow]

Collecting was known in Victorian times (19th century) and many fakes were at the time produced to satisfy the demands of collectors. Other antiques were ruined by being over-cleaned, altered, and/or decorated to suit the collector's fancy.

In some ways the fakes of the Victorian era are the ancestors of modern replicas.

Reenactment was happening at the same time, I believe. There were jousts in the 19th century using new armour and cobbled together old harnesses.

There may have been collecting and reenacting prior to the 19th century as well.

[Paul Hansen]

I think that collecting arms and armour is a very, very old hobby. For instance, king Phillips II of Spain purchased the collection of his father, emperor Charles V, in 1559. Charles V had a sizable collection of his own. His collection (called royal armoury, or Real Armeria) can now be visited in the royal palace in Madrid.

Fencing as a hobby is also very old, as manuscript I.33 from the 13th C. shows, but in my opinion, fencing (i.e. learning to fight with swords in a competitive manner) might be as old as swordmanship itself.

Making new weapons "in the style of" was popular in the late middle ages when Roman and Greek arms and armour inspired contemporary designs.

As Chad notes, the modern interest could be traced to the Victorian era. But I'm not sure that it's fair to call Victorian era reproductions "fakes", as I think that they were not neccessarily marketed as originals so there is little difference with modern reproductions.

[Chad Arnow]

[Alain D.]

Interesting points. I had thought that perhaps very wealthy aristocrats or royalty might be interested in collecting such items.

[Chad Arnow]

[Eric W. Norenberg]

'Lo, all!

Just in case anybody's not read this one yet:

http://www.myArmoury.com/feature_schmidt.html

Maybe a spiritual forefather of Albion, A & A, et al.?

Seems like nostalgic re-enactment has been around as long as we, as a species, have been mindful of our history. Many recorded tourneys and mock battles from the Middle Ages were themed / scripted to portray Arthurian, Roman, Greek, etc. feats of arms. But, yeah, as to the current state of things, I think we owe it to the Victorian-era (meaning that time period - England wasn't the only nation celebrating a-new its Medieval legacy) Medieval Revival movements, based themselves in reaction to the industrial age and the economic and political changes that came with it, for creating our current, enduring love affair with all that "Medieval Crappe", as my wife terms it. Just look at the Arts and Crafts movement, the Pre-Raphaelite Brotherhood, the Romantic authors and poets, the very serious revival of Gothic architecture. Both our romanticised imaginings of the period and our first steps toward an accurate historical reckoning of it come from the 19th century.

Sorry for the near-thesis, there. It's just my thing.

-Eric

[Matthew Amt]

If I'm recalling correctly, Alexander the Great stopped off at Troy on his way east, and carried off a shield said to have belonged to Achilles. That was probably a little more due to his egomania than a passion for collecting antiques, but still...

Matthew

[Jared Smith]

I'm not confident that Alexander would not have stopped at Troy to collect a battlefield artifact. (The site and surroundings presently considered by archeologists to be Troy VII does not yield that many weapon type artifacts, and its history after 1180 B.C. does not seem to have been that glorious.) Items like Achilles armour were supposed to have been moved to shrines. There were supposed to have been several Roman shrines containing artifacts from the Trojan war. I figure that might count as a sort of early beginning to museums.

[Douglas S]

Um, probably it was not the real site of Troy, nor was it probably really the shield of Achilles.

[Matthew Amt]

[Roger Hooper]

The Iliad was the most revered piece of literature in the ancient Greek and Roman world, people knew more or less where Troy had been, and many wanted to visit it. Alexander (who was obsessed with the Iliad and Achilles in particular) took the Shield of Achilles. There was also the Tomb of Achilles, where a 7 foot skeleton could be viewed. It wouldn't surprise me if there was a Lyre of Paris, a Sword of Hector, and a Golden Brassiere of Helen on display. In short, it was one of the world's first tourist traps.

[Jared Smith]