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Bill Tsafa
Location: Brooklyn, NY Joined: 20 May 2004
Posts: 599
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 Posted: Sun 19 Apr, 2009 6:48 pm Post subject: |
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| Lafayette C Curtis wrote: | | Vassilis Tsafatinos wrote: | | M. Eversberg II wrote: | Greek seems to have changed little...quite fortunate!
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I don't want to give the wrong impression. It has changed in a similar way to how early Middle English has changed to Modern English. You can make out a lot of the words, but with out proper training you can not fully understand everything. |
So true! I get a kick from comparing the way the medieval Greek in Byzantine texts differ from the ancient texts in Classical Greek.
Going back to the original topic, though, are we so sure that such swords were not used in the Middle Ages? There were no designs that closely resembled the falcata/kopis, true, but there were the various choppers illustrated in the Maciejowski Bible and all... |
As someone who can understand Greek it is interesting to hear original lines from the New Testament and compare them to their English chopped up translation. Funny to then watch television preachers go off on tangents based on those translations. It kind of makes a good case for the medieval bans on vernacular translations of the bible.
Funny to watch people take an everyday word like "kopis" and think it is a specific style or sword. The word just means cutter.
No athlete/youth can fight tenaciously who has never received any blows: he must see his blood flow and hear his teeth crack... then he will be ready for battle.
Roger of Hoveden, 1174-1201
www.poconoshooting.com
www.poconogym.com
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Tony Brass
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| Posted: Sun 19 Apr, 2009 9:23 pm Post subject: |
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Wow, that was a thoughtful answer. I guess the part of that that really sticks with me is that the leaf-blade and the falcata were thin blades. I pictured the falcata as thick in the spine and heavy. If it was thin in the cross section, then the forward curve would have compensated for that weakness, and made it more formidable.
In that case, the advent of the longer and more substantial two sided migration era sword would indeed have rendered the falcata's advantage almost obsolete. If they needed a shield, or helmet splitter, their sword could do the job as well as any falcata. And if not, the axe did the job much better.
I still imagine the falcata shape could be used in the role of the longseax. In that role it would still be useful, if not more versatile. (like the examples provided).
Grateful for all the insight.
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Bennison N
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| Posted: Mon 20 Apr, 2009 12:28 am Post subject: |
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| Vassilis Tsafatinos wrote: | | Funny to watch people take an everyday word like "kopis" and think it is a specific style or sword. The word just means cutter. |
Yeah, but for lack of a more correct term, "kopis" actually becomes the English term for the style of sword by default, doesn't it? What is the correct name for the style of sword in Greek?
Below are some Falcata cross-sections. The Falcata is actually a very advanced design when you take all the various bits and pieces into consideration...
 Attachment: 20.79 KB
Here are some Falcata Cross Sections. They do very well in improving the cut even further.
"Never give a sword to a man who can't dance" - Confucius
अजयखड्गधारी
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Bill Tsafa
Location: Brooklyn, NY Joined: 20 May 2004
Posts: 599
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| Posted: Mon 20 Apr, 2009 6:48 am Post subject: |
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| Bennison N wrote: | | Vassilis Tsafatinos wrote: | | Funny to watch people take an everyday word like "kopis" and think it is a specific style or sword. The word just means cutter. |
Yeah, but for lack of a more correct term, "kopis" actually becomes the English term for the style of sword by default, doesn't it? What is the correct name for the style of sword in Greek?
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Yes, giving the name "kopis" to a style of sword as an English definition is fine. I was just trying to nail down if that is what was being done. I did not know if someone might come forth with a specific reference to some ancient text what might prove otherwise. I have not come across any, but then again I have only looked at a small sample in detail. I am rather interested in finding out the answer to your question "What is the correct name for the style of sword in Greek?". I don't know if this information has survived.
No athlete/youth can fight tenaciously who has never received any blows: he must see his blood flow and hear his teeth crack... then he will be ready for battle.
Roger of Hoveden, 1174-1201
www.poconoshooting.com
www.poconogym.com
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James R.Fox
Location: Youngstowm,Ohio Joined: 29 Feb 2008
Posts: 253
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| Posted: Tue 21 Apr, 2009 7:31 am Post subject: |
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Sirs-the germanic tribes did use a version of the falcata, the falchion,with its blsde weight forward. Mr Oakshott, in his Archaeology if Weapons points out that they (forward weighted blades )were in use by the 500's or so, and illostrates one or two from Kraghul bog I think it was, However, they were very simple, blades, weighted at the point.
Ja68ms
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