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Forum Index > Historical Arms Talk > 16th Century Powder Flask Reply to topic
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Craig Shira




Location: California
Joined: 02 Feb 2007

Posts: 39

PostPosted: Thu 07 Aug, 2008 1:22 pm    Post subject: 16th Century Powder Flask         Reply with quote

.

Hello!

I do 16th century Landsknecht reenactment and, on occasion, I fire a match-lock harquebus/musket. For the past two years I have used a donut priming flask to carry my priming powder that used a spring-loaded nozzle to drop powder into my flash pan. Alas, my donut flask has lost its usefulnes and I am looking to replace it.

One of the frustrations I had with the donut flask was the spring nozzle. It would occasionally kick out the powder from my flash pan as I pressed the tip to get the poweder out, though that partially may be clumsiness on my part.

My question goes out to the musketeers out there: what powder flask works best for you? Are there any you would recommend for someone recreating the year 1536?

(Craig)

.
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Lin Robinson




Location: NC
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PostPosted: Thu 07 Aug, 2008 3:40 pm    Post subject: Re: 16th Century Powder Flask         Reply with quote

Craig...

Are you referring to the flask itself, or the dispensing mechanism, or both? Could we see a photo of what you have now?

Craig Shira wrote:
.

Hello!

I do 16th century Landsknecht reenactment and, on occasion, I fire a match-lock harquebus/musket. For the past two years I have used a donut priming flask to carry my priming powder that used a spring-loaded nozzle to drop powder into my flash pan. Alas, my donut flask has lost its usefulnes and I am looking to replace it.

One of the frustrations I had with the donut flask was the spring nozzle. It would occasionally kick out the powder from my flash pan as I pressed the tip to get the poweder out, though that partially may be clumsiness on my part.

My question goes out to the musketeers out there: what powder flask works best for you? Are there any you would recommend for someone recreating the year 1536?

(Craig)

.

Lin Robinson

"The best thing in life is to crush your enemies, see them driven before you and hear the lamentation of their women." Conan the Barbarian, 1982
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Gordon Frye




Location: Kingston, Washington
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PostPosted: Thu 07 Aug, 2008 9:30 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Craig;

I've found that the sort of priming flask that has a simple cut-off to it, either the sort as used in the small pistol flasks of the American Civil War era that are available (with brass flasks: the small ones actually make a decent priming flask for a musket), or the sort with a simple spring-loaded dog-leg cover over the spout. Press the end of the cover, up-end the flask, and powder in copious amounts flows forth.

Personally I've never liked the sort that you have to push into the pan to pour the powder into the pan with... too much work, too little powder, and too much likelihood of not enough powder getting into the pan.

Cheers!

Gordon

"After God, we owe our victory to our Horses"
Gonsalo Jimenez de Quesada
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Craig Shira




Location: California
Joined: 02 Feb 2007

Posts: 39

PostPosted: Thu 07 Aug, 2008 10:37 pm    Post subject: Powder Flask         Reply with quote

.

Gordon,

Thank you for your response. I was wondering if the small pistol flasks from the American Civil War would work for priming, but was unsure if they would dispense too little or too much powder. I have seen other pistol flasks from earlier periods available that are roughly the same size and release the same amount of powder as their later-period American brethren. The common powder amount appears to be either 12 and 24 grains. I would assume that the 12 grain variety would work best for a priming flask, since flash pans aren't very big.

Lin,

I was looking to replace the entire flask. The dispensing nozzle was a hassle even when it worked and the donut body made powder coming out of the top difficult even if the nozzle was completely removed. Below are pictures of my "annoying donut. " I tossed them on another server as to not bog down the myArmoury website with two poor-quality photographs.

http://www.bildbalger.com/livinghistory/donut1.jpg
http://www.bildbalger.com/livinghistory/donut2.jpg

I've seen donut flasks in one or two woodcuts of the Landsknechte soldiers, in addition to an instance of what looks like a powder horn. While I would like something to work easily and efficiently to fill my flash pan, accurately portraying the period of the 1530's is important too.

(Craig)

.
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Nathan Robinson
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PostPosted: Fri 08 Aug, 2008 9:10 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

I'm attaching a bunch of photos of 16th century (mostly?) powder flasks found at the Bayerisches Nationalmuseum, München.


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From the Bayerisches Nationalmuseum, München. [ Download ]

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From the Bayerisches Nationalmuseum, München. [ Download ]

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Lin Robinson




Location: NC
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PostPosted: Sat 09 Aug, 2008 7:12 am    Post subject: Re: Powder Flask         Reply with quote

Craig Shira wrote:
.
Lin,

I was looking to replace the entire flask. The dispensing nozzle was a hassle even when it worked and the donut body made powder coming out of the top difficult even if the nozzle was completely removed. Below are pictures of my "annoying donut. " I tossed them on another server as to not bog down the myArmoury website with two poor-quality photographs.

http://www.bildbalger.com/livinghistory/donut1.jpg
http://www.bildbalger.com/livinghistory/donut2.jpg

I've seen donut flasks in one or two woodcuts of the Landsknechte soldiers, in addition to an instance of what looks like a powder horn. While I would like something to work easily and efficiently to fill my flash pan, accurately portraying the period of the 1530's is important too.

(Craig)

.


Thanks for the photos. From the picture it looks like the dispenser is a version of one that I have used for years to prime flintlocks. In operation you place the nozzle into the pan, push down and a small amount of powder is released into the spout. Release and the spout closes off the main powder supply and the priming charge goes into the pan. I have never had any problem with the mechanism in mine. I am not sure how you were using it from what you said in your post. If you were pushing the nozzle into the flask with your finger, then releasing it while keeping your finger over the end, then pouring the powder into the pan, I can see why you might be having problems. Until I got a look at your flask, I was going to suggest using one of these nozzles.

Track of the Wolf at www.trackofthewolf.com, offers a number of different types of spouts, primarily for powder horns, but adaptable for flasks. I do not know of any compay producing replicas of 16th c. flasks at the moment and you may have to resort to diy or find someone who will make one for you, in order to stay true to your persona. Track does offer a powder horn valve kit that could be adapted to look very much like the valves that some of the flasks sported in the photos Nathan posted. It is a kit and will require some drilling, polishing and also tapping a screw thread. It is available in brass or iron.

Why not consider a horn or even a large antler, drilled for a powder chamber, with a valve of your choosing attached? I would think that appropriate for the 16th c.

Any way, I hope this has helped.

Lin Robinson

"The best thing in life is to crush your enemies, see them driven before you and hear the lamentation of their women." Conan the Barbarian, 1982
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Craig Shira




Location: California
Joined: 02 Feb 2007

Posts: 39

PostPosted: Sun 10 Aug, 2008 12:51 am    Post subject: Thanks         Reply with quote

.

Lin, this has been helpful. I have always put the nozzle straight into the pan like you described, but the nozzle only let a finite amount of powder out. So it perhaps might simply be a nozzle issue and not entirely the flask's fault.

The photographs provided by Nathan are also quite useful. Extant examples are always a boon. I especially like the two turtle shell flasks. A lot of them looked like they might have been carved antler.

Based on these comments, I'm going to see if I can fix my donut powder flask and get it dispensing happily before the San Francisco Renaissance Fair this coming weekend in Golden Gate park. Last year I was the only Landsknecht firing a gun because the rest of my Fähnlein was carrying pike. As the lone Landsknecht musketeer, I would hate to disappoint and not have my kit ready in time. If I don't, then I'll be in the pike line and the Italian musketeers I shoot with won't have to worry about being upstaged by a Viennese Landsknecht whose gun is twice as loud as theirs.

(Craig)

.
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Nathan Robinson
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PostPosted: Sun 10 Aug, 2008 12:56 am    Post subject: Re: Thanks         Reply with quote

Craig Shira wrote:
...and get it dispensing happily before the San Francisco Renaissance Fair this coming weekend in Golden Gate park....

I didn't realize that the faire was happening this weekend. I'm surprised they let you fire guns there...

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Lin Robinson




Location: NC
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PostPosted: Sun 10 Aug, 2008 5:45 am    Post subject: Re: Thanks         Reply with quote

Craig Shira wrote:
.

Lin, this has been helpful. I have always put the nozzle straight into the pan like you described, but the nozzle only let a finite amount of powder out. So it perhaps might simply be a nozzle issue and not entirely the flask's fault.
.


If you are simply priming with the flask then the 1 to 3 grains of powder dispensed by this type of nozzle should be sufficient. If not, just push it twice. If you have the 1 grain capacity nozzle, think about upgrading to the 3 grain, which is available at Track of the Wolf.

Glad to help.

Lin Robinson

"The best thing in life is to crush your enemies, see them driven before you and hear the lamentation of their women." Conan the Barbarian, 1982
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