[Bob Burns]

Thursday I bought a Del Tin "Viking Sword" from Kult of Athena, where I had been building an asset account towards the forthcoming Albion "Vassal", for which I had stopped in to put another $200.00 in cash towards this gorgeous sword that Peter Johnsson knocked himself out designing the pommel, surpassing all my expectations of excellence!
Well, I knew I was in trouble when Ryan pulled the sword out from behind the counter where I could not see it and laid it on the glass top of one of his display cases for me to check the sword out.
Needless to say, I could not resist the sword and my asset account is back to zero , but on the plus side I have a beautiful Del Tin Sword of which to my understanding are very hard to acquire.
Here's the particular concern and wonder I have, the sword weighs 1,950 grams or according to the metric conversion chart that I used, weighs 4.30 pounds. Here is a link to the picture of the sword and the other specs as I measured them.

http://www.deltin.net/2103.htm

Overall Length 39 3/4"
Blade Length 33 1/4"
Blade Width at Cross 2 1/16"
Blade Width Halfway Point 1 3/4"
Blade Width Near Point Transition 1 3/8"
Fuller Width which runs to 1" from point 11/16"
Inside Grip 3 5/8"
Crossguard Width 4 3/16"
Pommel Width 3 1/4"
Pommel Height 2"
Center of Balance From Cross 4 1/2"
Center of Percussion from Cross 19 "

True, the sword is nearly 40 inches long or 3 foot 3 3/4 inches and the blade is wide thru the total length, in the thick part of the blade which is on either side of the fuller it appears to be about 7/32 thinning to about 1/8 or 4/32 at the distal part of the blade (I was once tested for depth perception, I scored so high that the optometrist tested me a second time ).
I was wondering, is this sword too heavy for it's intended purpose and type of sword being a Type X in Ewart Oakeshotts typology of medieval swords?
Do Del Tin swords tend to be a bit overly heavy in general?
Don't get me wrong, I am more than thrilled to finally own a Del Tin Sword!

I remember showing my Arms & Armor Danish War Axe to someone knowledgable about medieval arms and he thought that the axe was historically incorrect because it was so light. Then I showed him on pages 103 thru 105 in my book "Ancient Weapons In Britain" by Logan Thompson 2004 Pen & Sword. Where it explains how there were original axe heads of these types of long hafted war axes that were surprisingly light and how this made for an axe that could be used in a diversity of strikes and so forth that a heavier axe of the same type could not viably function.

So I was wondering, were there Viking swords of the 10th century that were at or slightly above 4 pounds in weight?

Thanks Much!

Bob

[Bob Burns]

According to what they have to say on their company's history, Del Tin strives to be accurate of the original swords from which they base their replicas.
I am providing a copy and paste of this statement by Del Tin, which is pretty convincing of the authenticity of their swords. Still it seems to me that this sword that I bought, does seem a tad heavy but I am only in my 3rd year in this fantastic hobby and the passion of my lifetime!

OK, here is what Del Tin has to say.

Thanks Again!

Bob


Since 1965 we have been manufacturing with the utmost care in our workshop in Maniago, accurate high quality reproductions of selected old weapons and armour. Throughout these years we have analysed a great number of pieces typically found in museums and private collections and perfectly reproduced them. Our idea was to manufacture accurate replicas which in no way should be inferior in quality to their originals.

Nowadays the DEL TIN ARMI ANTICHE COMPANY led by Fulvio Del Tin, offers a wide range of original quality reproductions of old weapons from the bronze age through to the seventeenth century. Occasionally we use iconography of the time to create pieces no longer in existence.

Collectors worldwide have bought and appreciated our replicas which are also exibited in certain significant museums such as the Royal Armouries Museum in Leeds (UK) where our products are also actively utilised in fighting demonstrations, something only items of superior quality would be capable of.

In addition to the aforementioned our weapons and armour have been shown in numerous educational exhibitions, drawing the attention of both the general public and experts in the field. Furthermore an added compliment was paid to the company when our products were chosen to be used in such films as Braveheart and Robin Hood which incidently won an Oscar.

As a result of a serious and accurate manufacturing process, our weapons possess very good characteristics and may be used in medieval and renaissance combat. Indeed for quite some time numerous groups in Europe and the USA have been practising the art of swordsmanship using our swords, rapiers and daggers. We do however recommend for those desiring to use our weapons to do so carefully and in the proper way to avoid running any risks.

All of our sword and dagger blades are made of well tempered Chrome-Vanadium steel with a hardness of 50HRC. Fulvio Del Tin personally tempers the steel, a very delicate operation upon which the manufacture of a superior blade depends.

We conclude by saying that our swords would even have been suitable for medieval knights who entrusted their lives and good fortune to blades of superior temper.

[Justin King]

Del Tin's are considered by many to be over-weight in general but not necessarily outside of historical parameters. I have owned a number of DT's and have never really been satisfied by their balance and weight but this is according to personal preference. I think Italy has laws that prevent Del Tin from manufacturing sharp swords, so the thick edges that come standard on DT's are part of what makes them heavier than most sharpened repros. Their designs are, I think, intended to give the proportions and look of the originals while maintaining a fairly thick, safe edge, which adds up to extra weight, and a blade-heavy feel.

[Bob Burns]

Thanks Justin, I can appreciate what you have to say. Fortunately, this sword was previously sharpened and I have made it even sharper to where it's very sharp, but I can see what you say (currently looking at the Del Tin blade) and it is a bit thick towards the edge. Also, it has one beefed up hilt, the pommel is a good 7/8 inch thick and the crossguard goes from 13/16 to 9/16 inches in thickness.

Bob

[Corey D. Sullivan]

Hi Bob!

Now I'm not an expert, but I have heard a few things. One, Del Tin is known for making weapons that are usually significantly heavier then their historical counterparts. The reason? Del Tin makes their swords so as to balance all the facets of our hobby. reenactment, collecting, WMA, ect. Therefore, they are designed to withstand abuse from both reenactment and sparring. Thus, they are made heavier so as to be more durable.

As for being within a historical weight range, again, I'm not an expert, but the average weight of a "viking sword" was around 2.5 lbs. IMHO, I think that 4.3 lbs is far too heavy for a singlehanded sword.

However, this is just my understanding.

It looks like a very nice sword. I love the pommel carvings. I really like some of Del Tin's work, but I just wish they would lighten some of their blades.

-Cheers!

[Mike Arledge]

Bob,

I have been looking at that one too. DelTin makes some swords that are pretty top notch in terms of handling, but many, like this one, are a good deal to heavy to be used for fencing. As you can see from some of the excellent reviews up on here, there is a broad range depending on the model. Their best dark ages/viking models are the 2070 Migration (which I luckily own) and the 2105 Viking Model (which I hope to soon own). I was hoping you might be able to post some pics soon though of yours, because I hear it is lovely, but the DT stock photo is a bit dodgy.

I have seen people do some creative things to cut down on the weight, from shortening blades, to regrinding the edges, but I imagine this one's weight is in the cast pommel? But it sounds like its a lovely sword in its own right!

[Luka Borscak]

DT Viking swords are all too heavy and many of their other singlehanders (but viking swords especially when you consider their historic average weight), but their longswords are much more historically weighted. XIIa warsword DT 5143 which I ordered a month ago is 124cm long, it doesn't have much taper and it is still lighter than your viking, 1.700kg. Viking sword should also be shorter, average from 90 to 95cm, and like Corey said about 2.5lb (1.15, 1.20kg...).

[Thomas Parsons]

I have handled quite a few Del Tin swords mostly all replicas of late XIVth to early XVIth. I have found them all to be invariably on the heavy end of the scale yet still within historical parameters.

The snag is they do not replicate an average weight but the weight of one specific piece that always ends up weighing slighlty more as a replica designed for live sparring (sureley Mr. Johnsson can chime in with the more technical aspects that would cause this ) The fact that nearly all their original models are "heavyish" to start with is just unfortunate...

[Thomas Parsons]

I would add however that all the pieces I have had the good fortune to wield handle very well despite the weight.

[Jean Thibodeau]

Bob: Good to ask the questions but don't over obsess about it and start regretting the purchase.

I have a Del Tin Venetian two hander that weighs about 8 pounds and this is probably the upper limit in weigh of a using for war two hander as opposed to the bearing sword types that could go up to 15 pounds or more.

Since Del Tin swords are somewhat overbuilt for sparring they are not made to be optimum sharps but are not too far into boat anchor extremes.

Well, you can also look at it as the extra weight being good for making your lighter swords feel faster and be useful as a training tool: It not as if you didn't have lighter and faster swords also.

A variety of differently handling swords can be a good thing ! In other words: All your swords need not be light and fast.

Anyway, I'm giving you the " glass half full " perspective instead of the " glass half empty " one.

[Bob Burns]

Thanks Everyone so far, your replies "All of Them" have been very appreciated and helpful Jean, you took the words out of my mouth in reference of how this sword is heavier and therefore can be an excellent means of training and working out with so that I am all that faster with my lighter swords. This is exactly what I was just thinking about a few moments ago after reading all the posts.
I thought to myself: "Gee Bob, you've got a beautiful looking Del Tin sword and they are a long time wait to obtain, here you wound up with your favorite of all the Viking swords and in fact the largest of the Viking swords that Del Tin makes. If you practice with your Del Tin a lot, it's not only good physical therapy and excerise but it's still a light enough sword that you can wield the sword and still be very functional."
All the years of the physical activity I've done, the brutal weightlifting I used to do, I changed my naturally thin body into a very strong well muscled body and therefore I can effectively wield this sword to a certain degree for a decent amount of time. So the more I practice with it the stronger I will get in a different way, which will be entirely beneficial to the use with my other swords.
Also, I intentionally titled this thread so as that anyone can talk about any sword or medieval arms and as to the functional weight of that particular piece. I figured this way I could get some answers that I needed and still provide a thread that would benefit everyone else!

Thanks a Lot!

Bob

[Chad Arnow]

Del Tin swords vary in many aspects. Some handle great. Some are clunky in handling. Some are spot-on in weight, at least one actually weighs less than what it's based on, and some are overweight (from a little to a lot). But you can't claim that they're all over-weight, though it's probably fairly safe to say this model could be lighter.

Fulvio does design them all so that they can make acceptable cutters when sharpened but can pass if used as blunts in some applications, too. So you end up with a sword built for compromises: neither a purpose-built sharp nor a purpose-built blunt but something that can kind of work for either.

You may also want to weigh the sword yourself. 1950 grams is the published weight by the manufacturer and sometimes weight varies.

[Jeroen Zuiderwijk]

[Bob Burns]

I did some searching for original Viking swords, Type X in particular which I will list the length and page number of the following books.
Ancient Weapons in Britain by Logan Thompson 2004 Pen & Sword

96.5 cm or 38 inches on page 91

Swords of the Viking Age by Ian Peirce Boydell Press

Page 34 101.8 cm or 40.08 inches
blade 84.8 cm or 33.39 inches

Page 38 95.6 cm or 37.64 inches
blade 78.6 or 30.94 inches

Page 98 98.4 cm or 38.74 inches
blade 81 cm or 31.89 inches

Page 108 96.7 or 37.64 inches
blade 77.7 or 30.59 inches


To simplify from having to scroll up, my Del Tin Viking Sword which is the longest of their Viking swords is as follows

100.96 cm or 39.75 inches

84.45 cm or 33.25 inches

The standard weight for my model of Viking Sword is a whopping 1,950 grams or 4.30 pounds


I did this search on various Viking Type X sword lengths so as to be of assistance to anyone who might be interested.
One thing for sure and this is the most important, that being how I feel about my new Del Tin Sword? I love it, I get a real nice feeling inside when I pick it up, same as the first time I picked it up on Thursday. There was no question in my mind, I knew it was on the heavy side, but I just felt a spiritual connection that I could not deny!

Thanks Again! And please feel free about functional weights of any replica swords or other arms!

Bob

[Bob Burns]

Here is the link to a picture of all the 10th century Del Tin Viking Swords together side by side in one picture.

http://www.deltin.net/10thc.htm

Mine of course is the 4th sword from the left, the other sword that is still in stock is the 3rd from the left, which I considered buying for a bit, I liked the solid bronze hilt with the crosses on the pommel, grip and crossguard, but to me I was more happy with the one I chose, since these are 10th century and from what I understand the most of the Vikings were still pagan then, so it kind of conflicted with me in regard to the time period and a Christian Viking Sword in the 900s.
The one that is still in stock weighs 1800 grams or 3.97 pounds and is a bit over an inch shorter.

Just in case anyone is interested.

Bob