| Author |
Message |
Rodolfo Martínez
|
 Posted: Thu 20 Dec, 2007 2:22 pm Post subject: Flammard bladed hand and a half swords |
 |
|
Hello people.
I was looking at some Flamberges and i was told that the blade is called flammard blade. I have seen this type of blade in rapiers too.
Do you know if flammard bladed bastards swords existed during XVI century, or single handed heavy cavalry swords with that special featured, used for combat instead of parade?
Thanks!
¨Sólo me desenvainarás por honor y nunca me envainarás sin gloria¨
|
|
  |
 |
Nathan Robinson
myArmoury Admin
|
|
  |
|
|
J. Pav
|
| Posted: Thu 20 Dec, 2007 5:44 pm Post subject: |
|
|
For some reason, I believe I've seen a flambard basket-hilt somewhere...
But it might just be a weird, composite memory...
|
|
 |
|
|
Gregg Sobocinski
|
| Posted: Thu 20 Dec, 2007 6:35 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| J. Pav wrote: | For some reason, I believe I've seen a flambard basket-hilt somewhere...
But it might just be a weird, composite memory... |
You did see a flambard basket hilt reviewed here:
http://www.myArmoury.com/review_dw_tranrap.html
To save time, the relevant paragraph about "flambard" or "flamberge" blades is reprinted below:
" This wavy "flambard" style of blade is not typical of later period swords, and would have been more commonly seen in early Renaissance weapons, although the style was by no means unknown for the time period. I have seen a number of flambard-bladed daggers in museums, so it is not a large stretch of the imagination to use such a blade for this particular hilt. Ironically, the word "flamberge" has been used to describe earlier wavy-bladed swords, but later was used to describe dish-hilted rapiers with straight blades." {From hands-on review by Bill Grandy}
|
|
|
|
|
|
Ivo Malz
Location: Hanau, Germany Joined: 08 Jan 2005
Posts: 30
|
| Posted: Fri 21 Dec, 2007 5:36 am Post subject: |
|
|
|
In my book Flamberg is filed under Renaisance two- handed sword (Bidenhander) with wavy blade.
|
|
|
|
|
Antal László
|
| Posted: Fri 21 Dec, 2007 6:06 am Post subject: |
|
|
|
What was the purpose of this form of blade? Does it have an advantage contrary to a straight blade, or was it made just because it looked cool?
|
|
 |
|
Jean Thibodeau
|
| Posted: Fri 21 Dec, 2007 6:53 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Antal László wrote: | | What was the purpose of this form of blade? Does it have an advantage contrary to a straight blade, or was it made just because it looked cool? |
From previous long discussions here on myArmoury about this I would say from memory that:
( A quick search gave me this Topic thread which " answers " or at least goes over the possibilities
http://www.myArmoury.com/talk/viewtopic.php?t=629&start=0 )
A summery of possible reasons:
1) The most probable: Yes it's cool and looks mean and aggressive.
2) Might or might not be a better cutter in the ways of a serrated blade: This might or not be true, but was believed to be so in period I think. Opinions vary from it has no effect on cutting to yes it does but the degree of extra cutting ability may be less than the effort in producing such a blade would justify.
3) The waves might have an effect in the bind or parry and give an advantage to one using the blade and used to the way it and another blade respond in contact to each other compared to the opponent who may find the contact weird or surprising. The very very short amount of time needed to adapt may be enough to affect reaction time ? Tiny amounts of time ( hesitation ) can make a great deal of difference to the results of a fight. ( No consensus about this either !  )
4) Showpiece displaying the skill of the swordmaker.
5) Aesthetic/art related reasons: Related to reason #1 but more for beauty than to impress/ intimidate.
6) Who know ? All the other reasons I can think about right now.  
You can easily give up your freedom. You have to fight hard to get it back!
|
|
|
|
|
|
J. Pav
|
| Posted: Fri 21 Dec, 2007 7:59 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Gregg Sobocinski wrote: | | J. Pav wrote: | For some reason, I believe I've seen a flambard basket-hilt somewhere...
But it might just be a weird, composite memory... |
You did see a flambard basket hilt reviewed here:
http://www.myArmoury.com/review_dw_tranrap.html |
Nope. I didn't mean a rapier(and that's not a basket-hilt, anyway).
What I meant was a Baskethilt Broadsword. It may have even been in the MET...
And YES! A quick search of the museum photo-album has revealed it! It's a Mortuary hilt, so my memory was indeed a little bit off. Regardless...
http://www.myArmoury.com/albums/photo/3411.html
|
|
|
|
|
Chad Arnow
myArmoury Team
|
|
|
|
|
Rodolfo Martínez
|
| Posted: Fri 21 Dec, 2007 4:03 pm Post subject: |
|
|
What about cavalry arming swords with wavy blades during early Renaissance?
Do you know if any surviving combat bastard swords has this wavy blade? (For cavalry combat?
Thanks!
And happy holidays to you too!
¨Sólo me desenvainarás por honor y nunca me envainarás sin gloria¨
|
|
|
|
|
|
Robin Palmer
Location: herne bay Kent UK Joined: 21 Dec 2007
Posts: 138
|
| Posted: Mon 24 Dec, 2007 7:26 am Post subject: |
|
|
I have seen single handed broad swords Bastards and two handers with Flam bard blades I believe the Wallace collection in London has a two hander. I believe they had their hay-day in the 16-17th century.
As to advantages I read some where that they were believed to inflict more serious wounds than standard blades. Given the shape this is possible but I have my doubts if the degree of wounding was enough to warrant the extra effort involved in making them which may account for their decline. Although not technically flambard blades with almost serrated edges composed of scollop's were far more common. I have seen quiet a few of those and they tend to date after the flambard style blades stopped. I suspect that they proved more effective and easier to produce. I hope this is of use.
R. palmer
|
|
|
|
|
|
Marton Pap
Location: Hungary Joined: 16 Jan 2006
Posts: 47
|
| Posted: Tue 25 Dec, 2007 6:52 am Post subject: |
|
|
Hi!
Here are two mid 16th century hand and a halfs from the book Kardok (authors: Lugosi + Temesváry)
Happy Holydays!
 Attachment: 116.74 KB
Caption says:
Flambard bladed western type hand and a half sword, mid 16th century [ Download ]
Attachment: 120.36 KB
Caption says:
Flambard bladed western type sword, mid 16th century [ Download ]
|
|
|
|
|
Rodolfo Martínez
|
| Posted: Tue 25 Dec, 2007 9:36 am Post subject: |
|
|
Wow Marton, those are awesome swords!
Thank you for uploading them.
Merry Christmas to all!!
¨Sólo me desenvainarás por honor y nunca me envainarás sin gloria¨
|
|
|
|
|
|
Phil D.
|
| Posted: Wed 26 Dec, 2007 5:20 pm Post subject: |
|
|
I don't know if this is considered a flambard...I love this thing anyway!!!
Sorry for the bad pics
"A bottle of wine contains more philosophy than all the books in the world." -- Louis Pasteur
"A gentleman should never leave the house without a sharp knife, a good watch, and great hat."
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
This is a standard topic
