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Manouchehr M.
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Joe Fults
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 Posted: Thu 03 May, 2007 7:44 pm Post subject: |
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I really appreciate you taking the time to find and share some of the more exotic (to me) weapons you post.
So many times I find myself looking in wonder at things I could not imagine existed.
"The goal shouldn’t be to avoid being evil; it should be to actively do good." - Danah Boyd
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Manouchehr M.
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Korey J. Lavoie
Location: New Hampshire, USA Joined: 06 Apr 2006
Posts: 63
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| Posted: Thu 03 May, 2007 11:56 pm Post subject: |
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That's one of those swords that just makes you stop and say "Wow." The blade is incredible but I'm very curious about the Handle too . . . It looks like it combines metal and organic components. What a Work of Art.
From the hundred year war
To the Crimea
With a Lance and a Musket and a Roman Spear
To all of the Men who have stood with no fear
In the Service of the King
-The Clash: The Card Cheat
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Lafayette C Curtis
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| Posted: Sat 05 May, 2007 12:31 am Post subject: |
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Which part of Indonesia does it come from, anyway? As you all know, mine is a pretty large country with a large number of martial cultures as well, so "Indonesian" doesn't really help much for definign the weapon's ethnographic provenance. Moreover, the weapon looks rather modern, or at least heavily influenced by Dutch or Chinese designs (or both)
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Manouchehr M.
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| Posted: Sat 05 May, 2007 12:52 am Post subject: |
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| Lafayette C Curtis wrote: | | Which part of Indonesia does it come from, anyway? As you all know, mine is a pretty large country with a large number of martial cultures as well, so "Indonesian" doesn't really help much for definign the weapon's ethnographic provenance. Moreover, the weapon looks rather modern, or at least heavily influenced by Dutch or Chinese designs (or both) |
Hi Lafayette
This is a real old weapon and not a modern one.
Let us get more specific here. Van Sonnefeld (2001:102) shows a similar example in his book entitled "TRaditional WEapons of the Indonesian Archipelago" and classifies this type as Pedang III:
"Sumatra, Palembang. A sword usually with a slightly curved, sometimes straight blade. THis blade may be forged smooth, with pamor or incrustations. Near the hilt (made of horn) or near the point forged ornaments may occur. The blade's sides are either flat or concave. The hilt's end has leaf-shaped motifs carved in relief. Usually the hilt is silver plated, sometimes covering only the hilt's lower part, sometimes covering the entrie hilt from the blade to the carved part. This plating may have chased or chiseled ornamental motifs. The scabbard may be made of smoothly finished wood, but often has silver bands, or is entirely silver plated"
Kind regards
Manouchehr
http://www.mmkhorasani.com
http://www.arms-and-armor-from-iran.de
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Manouchehr M.
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| Posted: Sat 05 May, 2007 12:57 am Post subject: |
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The next example has also a pamor blade but not as nice as the first one.
Courtesy of Oriental Arms
"A very nice Parang sword from Indonesia. 20 inches long pamor blade Carved horn hilt in a white metal collar and wood scabbard bound with white metal fittings. 27 inches total length."
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http://www.mmkhorasani.com
http://www.arms-and-armor-from-iran.de
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Korey J. Lavoie
Location: New Hampshire, USA Joined: 06 Apr 2006
Posts: 63
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| Posted: Sat 05 May, 2007 2:44 am Post subject: |
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This is quickly becoming another one of my favorite weapon designs. They have a very nice air of understated elegance, can someone tell me who exactly used them? In regards to Social Class and what they where used for? I know I can't be the only one looking at the point and thinking of a Broken-Back Seax, even though that probably isn't the fairest comparison.
Thank you yet again Manouchehr.
From the hundred year war
To the Crimea
With a Lance and a Musket and a Roman Spear
To all of the Men who have stood with no fear
In the Service of the King
-The Clash: The Card Cheat
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Lafayette C Curtis
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| Posted: Sat 05 May, 2007 6:47 am Post subject: |
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Ah. Palembang. It's probably a weapon from the early modern era, then--the decoration and everything looks like it comes from the 16th or 17th centuries. Which means it still qualifies as a genuine antique, just that the decoration and form is a little more "international" in style and less strikingly insular than weapons made even earlier. I take it the second example also comes from Sumatra? The profusion of metal elements on the scabbard is probably an Indian or Turkish influence, which is srongest there.
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Manouchehr M.
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| Posted: Sat 05 May, 2007 8:02 am Post subject: |
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| Korey J. Lavoie wrote: | This is quickly becoming another one of my favorite weapon designs. They have a very nice air of understated elegance, can someone tell me who exactly used them? In regards to Social Class and what they where used for? I know I can't be the only one looking at the point and thinking of a Broken-Back Seax, even though that probably isn't the fairest comparison.
Thank you yet again Manouchehr. |
You are very welcome Korey. I cannot give you any information regarding social class of people who carried this weapon. But maybe other members will join in and add to this thread. THis is indeed an elegant weapon.
Kind regards
Manouchehr
http://www.mmkhorasani.com
http://www.arms-and-armor-from-iran.de
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Manouchehr M.
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| Posted: Sat 05 May, 2007 8:03 am Post subject: |
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| Lafayette C Curtis wrote: | | Ah. Palembang. It's probably a weapon from the early modern era, then--the decoration and everything looks like it comes from the 16th or 17th centuries. Which means it still qualifies as a genuine antique, just that the decoration and form is a little more "international" in style and less strikingly insular than weapons made even earlier. I take it the second example also comes from Sumatra? The profusion of metal elements on the scabbard is probably an Indian or Turkish influence, which is srongest there. |
As I mentioned it is a genunine antqiue. What do you exactly mean by Indian and Turkish influence on this piece?
Regards
Manocuhehr
http://www.mmkhorasani.com
http://www.arms-and-armor-from-iran.de
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Lafayette C Curtis
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| Posted: Sun 06 May, 2007 4:03 am Post subject: |
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Exactly that--the metal scabbard decoration looks a bit like a local assimiliations of Turkish, Persian, or Muslim Indian designs, because older native scabbards tend to have few if any metal components. I assume we're all aware that the early-modern Islamic kingdoms in Sumatra had extensive trading contacts with Ottoman Turkey, Safavid Persia, and Mughal India, and that the Sumatran products were often heavily influenced by this trade.
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Manouchehr M.
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| Posted: Sun 06 May, 2007 5:57 am Post subject: |
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Dear friends,
The next one is really interesting as it has the inscriptions:
There is no God but Allah
Mohammad is his messenger (prophet).
Courtesy of Oriental Arms
"A very unusual Parang sword from Indonesia. Fullered blade 22 inches long inlaid with Arabic characters. Carved wood hilt in a brass collar and wood scabbard bound with braided rattan fibers soaked in black lacquer. Original carrying cord. 31 inches total length."
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http://www.mmkhorasani.com
http://www.arms-and-armor-from-iran.de
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This is a standard topic