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Tobi S.





Joined: 30 Nov 2014

Posts: 1

PostPosted: Sun 30 Nov, 2014 1:54 pm    Post subject: Search for Specific Medieval Hilt-Type         Reply with quote

Hey there,
I'm new here and don't know, if my question is already answered in a different thread (I apologize, if it is) , but several quick searches didn't bring any results so far.
I'm searching for a very specific type of medieval hilts. This type has an flat disc-shaped pommel (Oakeshott Type G) and a tang, which rises over the top of the pommel. A protruding tang is very common for swords with pommels of Oakeshott Type I-K (see picture 1 for an example from Bonn, Germany) , but I can't find examples for Oakeshott Type G, except one sword from a collection in Paris (see picture 2).
So here is my question: Do you know any analogies in the 13th and 14th centuries?
Thanks,
Tobi
P.S. Sorry for the horrible English, I'm not a native speaker...



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Shahril Dzulkifli




Location: Malaysia
Joined: 13 Dec 2007
Likes: 1 page

Posts: 1,265

PostPosted: Tue 02 Dec, 2014 8:28 am    Post subject: Search for Specific Medieval Hilt-Type         Reply with quote

I am not quite sure what type of hilt that these swords originally had, Tobi.
Maybe there's somebody here in this forum who can help you identify their hilts.

“You have power over your mind - not outside events. Realize this, and you will find strength”

- Marcus Aurelius
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Mikko Kuusirati




Location: Finland
Joined: 16 Nov 2004
Reading list: 13 books

Posts: 981

PostPosted: Tue 02 Dec, 2014 10:52 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

I think he's asking about hilts that, put short, combine a simple type G disk pommel with a peen block.

And he's right, those are rare indeed - if they exist at all! I can't think of a single one myself. As far as I know, type G pommels faded from popularity before peen blocks became a thing. Even the one pictured in the opening post probably did not have a peen block, IMO; as far as I can tell, the pommel has simply shifted down due to corrosion and thus exposed the end of the tang, which was originally peened flush with the pommel (like on all historical type G pommels I know of).

But, more likely than not, the very moment I say type G pommels did not have peen blocks, someone will post a picture of such a thing. So the most I'm willing to say is that I've never seen one myself. Happy

The subtle tongue, the sophist guile, they fail when the broadswords sing;
Rush in and die, dogs -- I was a man before I was a king.
-- R. E. Howard, The Road of Kings
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Cerjak JL




Location: FRANCE
Joined: 22 Dec 2010

Posts: 34

PostPosted: Wed 03 Dec, 2014 1:45 am    Post subject: Re: Search for Specific Medieval Hilt-Type         Reply with quote

Tobi S. wrote:
Hey there,
I'm new here and don't know, if my question is already answered in a different thread (I apologize, if it is) , but several quick searches didn't bring any results so far.
I'm searching for a very specific type of medieval hilts. This type has an flat disc-shaped pommel (Oakeshott Type G) and a tang, which rises over the top of the pommel. A protruding tang is very common for swords with pommels of Oakeshott Type I-K (see picture 1 for an example from Bonn, Germany) , but I can't find examples for Oakeshott Type G, except one sword from a collection in Paris (see picture 2).
So here is my question: Do you know any analogies in the 13th and 14th centuries?
Thanks,
Tobi
P.S. Sorry for the horrible English, I'm not a native speaker...





Hi Tobi

I own one great war sword type XII with type J or G pommel "with a tang, which rises over the top of the pommel"
See below pics.
best
Cerjak



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Kai Lawson




Location: Madison, WI
Joined: 26 Aug 2010
Likes: 7 pages

Posts: 482

PostPosted: Wed 03 Dec, 2014 6:42 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

That doesn't look like a type G pommel to me, but it is a very attractive piece!
"And they crossed swords."
--William Goldman, alias S. Morgenstern
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Mikko Kuusirati




Location: Finland
Joined: 16 Nov 2004
Reading list: 13 books

Posts: 981

PostPosted: Wed 03 Dec, 2014 9:35 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

No, that's a very clear Type J. (And a very nice one, too. Happy)

The Type G is the simplest of the wheel pommel forms, just a plain disk, often with slightly convex or concave faces. No chamfered edges or raised centers.

The subtle tongue, the sophist guile, they fail when the broadswords sing;
Rush in and die, dogs -- I was a man before I was a king.
-- R. E. Howard, The Road of Kings
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Luka Borscak




Location: Croatia
Joined: 11 Jun 2007
Likes: 7 pages

Posts: 2,235

PostPosted: Mon 29 Dec, 2014 4:41 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Here is one...


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Mike Ruhala




Location: Stuart, Florida
Joined: 24 Jul 2011

Posts: 328

PostPosted: Tue 30 Dec, 2014 3:32 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

I think that one might be an R.
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Luka Borscak




Location: Croatia
Joined: 11 Jun 2007
Likes: 7 pages

Posts: 2,235

PostPosted: Tue 30 Dec, 2014 4:36 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

I first thought so also, but after some time looking at it I decided I think it's a G. But still, it might be an R. We would have to see other angles. Here is the complete sword: https://www.facebook.com/195698570567502/photos/pcb.530671880403501/530671817070174/?type=1&theater
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Mike Ruhala




Location: Stuart, Florida
Joined: 24 Jul 2011

Posts: 328

PostPosted: Tue 30 Dec, 2014 9:29 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Interesting, in the full length picture it appears it might be a disk with radically convex faces.
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