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Christopher B Lellis




Location: Houston, Texas
Joined: 01 Dec 2012

Posts: 268

PostPosted: Mon 19 Aug, 2013 12:43 am    Post subject: Militaryheritage.com swords         Reply with quote

I was looking for the pattern 1908 sword and came across this website;
http://www.militaryheritage.com/swords2.htm
But also came across one of my favorite sabers, the 1796 Light Cavalry Sabre.

Assuming the quality is good, those are some very reasonably priced swords. They claim they are hand forged and battle-ready but that is a widely used term. They don't mention if they are peened or have a threaded nut in the hilts.

Has anyone here bought any of these?
I am only interested in buying very well made, reasonably accurate historical recreations, that's why I'm a big fan of Albion. Do these stack up to my standards?


I hope these aren't cold steel swords...
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Mikko Kuusirati




Location: Finland
Joined: 16 Nov 2004
Reading list: 13 books

Posts: 973

PostPosted: Mon 19 Aug, 2013 1:14 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

AFAIK, Cold Steel and Military Heritage get much of their blades, at least, from the same source, probably Windlass. This is not a bad thing - by all accounts, Windlass produce excellent blades when working to spec (their own products suffer from a lack of historical research, more than anything).
The subtle tongue, the sophist guile, they fail when the broadswords sing;
Rush in and die, dogs -- I was a man before I was a king.
-- R. E. Howard, The Road of Kings
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Christine Munro




Location: Oxford
Joined: 01 Jun 2007

Posts: 39

PostPosted: Mon 19 Aug, 2013 1:20 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

The Royal Artillery Officer's Sword near the bottom of the page looks very much like something I unwittingly picked up a few years ago. The quality's kind of not bad for a wall-hanger, but I have no idea as to its construction: I certainly wouldn't risk putting it to the test. Not that it'd cut anything anyway, it's very much a blunt-edged piece. I was rather disappointed at the rather muddy quality of the detailing on the blade, but I guess that's part and parcel of the price range. On the other hand, as someone pointed out to me, the scabbard is of not unreasonable quality.

I tried to track down the origin of the sword in question and as far as I could tell it appeared to be one of the made-in-India replicas, though I can't verify that with any degree of certainty. If it's what I thought it was, the assertion seemed to be that it was one of the better examples of its type.

Sigh, that's not really very conclusive, is it? "It looks like a sword I own whose provenance is uncertain": make of that what you will. Big Grin
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Christopher B Lellis




Location: Houston, Texas
Joined: 01 Dec 2012

Posts: 268

PostPosted: Mon 19 Aug, 2013 2:22 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

I think it is cold steels sword.

Here is the military heritage photo


Here is a cold steel photo


If you can see a difference you have a better eye than me.
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Gottfried P. Doerler




Location: Tyrol, Austria
Joined: 11 Oct 2009
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Posts: 228

PostPosted: Mon 19 Aug, 2013 3:37 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

im not totally sure, but imho militaryheritage get their swords from weaponedge
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Ian Hutchison




Location: Louisiana / Nordrhein-Westholland
Joined: 27 Nov 2007

Posts: 486

PostPosted: Mon 19 Aug, 2013 4:40 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

The same swords are sold under the brand "Universal Swords" on Kult of Athena. From all the stories I've heard, I'd much rather deal with Ryan at KoA than the folks at MH.
'We are told that the pen is mightier than the sword, but I know which of these weapons I would choose.' - Adrian Carton de Wiart
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Charles B McFadden




Location: Houston
Joined: 12 May 2013

Posts: 13

PostPosted: Mon 19 Aug, 2013 6:02 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Hey Christopher, I have read from several different comments on other forums that cold steel does a good job on that particular sword the 1796 Light Cavalry Sabre. I'd sight the sources if I could remember where they were, it gets a decent amount of praise.

So even if it is cold steel you might want to reconsider, plus you get it cheaper from this militaryheritage than from cold steel itself.
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Christopher B Lellis




Location: Houston, Texas
Joined: 01 Dec 2012

Posts: 268

PostPosted: Mon 19 Aug, 2013 6:14 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Gottfried P. Doerler wrote:
im not totally sure, but imho militaryheritage get their swords from weaponedge


By the look of it, quite possibly.

Oh wow, they even have the heavy Calvary version, I haven't seen anyone else make that.
Book marking them Happy

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Mikko Kuusirati




Location: Finland
Joined: 16 Nov 2004
Reading list: 13 books

Posts: 973

PostPosted: Mon 19 Aug, 2013 6:52 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Charles B McFadden wrote:
Hey Christopher, I have read from several different comments on other forums that cold steel does a good job on that particular sword the 1796 Light Cavalry Sabre. I'd sight the sources if I could remember where they were, it gets a decent amount of praise.

Well, here's Mike Harris's review on Sword Buyers Guide.

And a thread on Sword Forum International comparing the Cold Steel reproduction to an original antique.

Quote:
So even if it is cold steel you might want to reconsider, plus you get it cheaper from this militaryheritage than from cold steel itself.

You can also get it Kult of Athena. I'd recommend that.

The subtle tongue, the sophist guile, they fail when the broadswords sing;
Rush in and die, dogs -- I was a man before I was a king.
-- R. E. Howard, The Road of Kings
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Jonathan Hopkins




PostPosted: Mon 19 Aug, 2013 7:16 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

If your standards are Albion standards, then no, I doubt these swords will stack up. To my knowledge, there are no production companies making Albion quality replicas of 19th century military swords. To obtain such a replica you would probably have to go to a custom maker. The MH swords are made by either Weapon Edge or Universal Swords. Dave Kelly has done a number of reviews of Weapon Edge and Universal Swords products at the Sword Buyers Guide Forum.
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Robert Muse




Location: Washington
Joined: 28 Sep 2009
Likes: 1 page

Posts: 466

PostPosted: Mon 19 Aug, 2013 8:21 am    Post subject: Heavy 1796 sword         Reply with quote

Good Morning,

Well I had that sword. I have never seen another replica, and perhaps I had seen too many episodes of Sharpe's Rifles, so I had to buy it. I'm not an expert on this time period, but I understand that the original blades were shaped and ground on a wheel, while these are hammered out.

It was hard to sharpen, very blade heavy, and the scabbard rusted in my gun safe. Nothing else ever did!

You would never confuse it for an Albion. Had it been better made, I would have kept it. But it did look great displayed with an original shako.

Well worth the money, just don't expect too much.

Robert
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Gottfried P. Doerler




Location: Tyrol, Austria
Joined: 11 Oct 2009
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Posts: 228

PostPosted: Mon 19 Aug, 2013 10:34 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Jonathan Hopkins wrote:
The MH swords are made by either Weapon Edge or Universal Swords.


and these 2 companies might actually be the same, or at least have the same local smiths,
their swords not only look the same and their catalogue is more or less identical, they also are both located in jodhpur, rajastan.
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Jonathan Hopkins




PostPosted: Mon 19 Aug, 2013 10:49 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

According to this post from the SBG forum, they are separate companies:

Quote:
Dear Sirs,

Once again I want to clarify the situation with universal swords that , WEI is not connected with universal swords . before Universal swords were used to sell there indian style swords in local indian markets now they have got our blue prints and mould from some ways and they are trying to compete us... just for 3-4 months now they had seen there capability and started manufacturing cheap quality viking and Roman swords which don't have perfect measurements from any manner... but We make custom swords for Military officers and we had received appreciation certificates from military for best quality swords.

So now please dont compare Weapon Edge India with Universals..

Best Regards,
Nitesh Chouhan
C.E.O. WEAPONEDGEINDIA
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Mark Griffin




Location: The Welsh Marches, in the hills above Newtown, Powys.
Joined: 28 Dec 2006

Posts: 801

PostPosted: Tue 20 Aug, 2013 6:30 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

I have many of these for re-enactment use doing light and heavy cav impressions. My unit below, 1st Royal Dragoons 1815, although I'm not in that one.

They take a bit of getting used to and are designed to cleave people, and certainly with the heavy there is not much finesse. You can give someone a jolly good poke with the tip, especially if you have done the hatchet conversion as per pre waterloo.

I have known them to last years or seconds. We hit edge to edge and you takes your pick and let the fates decide.



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Mark Griffin




Location: The Welsh Marches, in the hills above Newtown, Powys.
Joined: 28 Dec 2006

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PostPosted: Tue 20 Aug, 2013 6:32 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

and the brave boys in full effect. Think we will be up to about 15-18 by 2015 for the big one.


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Ian Hutchison




Location: Louisiana / Nordrhein-Westholland
Joined: 27 Nov 2007

Posts: 486

PostPosted: Tue 20 Aug, 2013 8:33 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Mark Griffin wrote:
and the brave boys in full effect. Think we will be up to about 15-18 by 2015 for the big one.


Excellent photo, Mark.

Btw, I think Nielo sword makes a few Napoleonic patterns, I believe there is also a French company providing them as well, if anyone is interested in an alternative to the Indian versions.

'We are told that the pen is mightier than the sword, but I know which of these weapons I would choose.' - Adrian Carton de Wiart
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Elling Polden




Location: Bergen, Norway
Joined: 19 Feb 2004
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PostPosted: Tue 20 Aug, 2013 11:44 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

I have their Hadik sabre, and for the price I am quite happy with it.
It is a large sword to start with; 85 cm from hilt to tip. However, the weight is about 1060g, not bad for such a large sword.
While fast in the cut, the mass distribution (lack of pommel) makes it unresponsive to small movements, and as such the sword is not well suited for light "fencing".
But the steel in the blade is certainly up for it.

I must admit that my experience with period sabres is too limited to say if this is the way a cavalry sabre is supposed to handle, but overall it is a beautifull, well made sword with a good scabbard for a great price.

"this [fight] looks curious, almost like a game. See, they are looking around them before they fall, to find a dry spot to fall on, or they are falling on their shields. Can you see blood on their cloths and weapons? No. This must be trickery."
-Reidar Sendeman, from King Sverre's Saga, 1201
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Patrick Kelly




Location: Wichita, Kansas
Joined: 17 Aug 2003
Reading list: 42 books

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PostPosted: Tue 20 Aug, 2013 6:49 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

I've owned a couple of these over the years and they're a decent buy for their price point. The blades lack the subtleties in their blade geometry you see in antique examples, but for the price they're okay.
"In valor there is hope.".................. Tacitus
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Edward Lee




Location: New York
Joined: 05 Jul 2013

Posts: 313

PostPosted: Wed 21 Aug, 2013 2:31 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

These are indeed made by Universal swords. I think most of these early modern swords bare the similarity, as in made by almost the same company. Don't get me wrong, but some of the Cold Steel military swords does look like the ones made by either Deepeka or Universal Sword.
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Christopher B Lellis




Location: Houston, Texas
Joined: 01 Dec 2012

Posts: 268

PostPosted: Wed 21 Aug, 2013 5:23 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

I found this video, here are Universal swords being made


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dqU8ThjzIZA


URL does not work.
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