[Michael Curl]

Sounds like he was very lucky to survive.

[Kurt Scholz]

[Ushio Kawana]

Thanks

[Kurt Scholz]

[Ushio Kawana]

Hi all

thanks Kurt


I looked for the detailed description of Battle of Pavia.
And I found this text. http://www.deremilitari.org/resources/pdfs/giono.pdf

[Joel Minturn]

It sounds like the guy was sufficated or drowned.

With out knowing more I can't say for sure but he could have punctured a lung and drowned on his blood or pushed into the mud or the weight of a horse or armoured person on his body could have sufficated him

Hope that helps.

[William P]

[Ushio Kawana]

Hi all

Thanks Joel Minturn and William P

I misunderstood it!
I thought that "stifled = pressed".
I thought that his (armoured) body was pressed by (knees of) armoured horse.
ummmmm... A English word has many means... It is too difficult to translation for me.

http://www.deremilitari.org/resources/pdfs/giono.pdf

[Michael Curl]

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/stifle

To be stifled to death inside your armour means that you cannot breathe properly and suffocate, usually because there are too many people around sucking up your air and the claustrophobic situation in your armour makes it too hard to breath, etc.

[Luka Borscak]

I think in this particular case it might be that he was pressed hard by his horse and his armor deformed and pressed his body too much to breathe. But he might also just be captured by horses body and by bodies of fallen men and he was suffocated.

[Ushio Kawana]

Hi all

Thanks Michael & Luka

These armours are very famous.

We know that these armours are displayed in Metropolitan museum.
But I have very simple questions.

Q1. Were these armours really used in battles?
Q2. Were these armours worn by gendarmes?
Q3. Are these armours(man's and Horse's) for parades? (These armours are great etched.)


I found a page of detailed explanation.
http://www.metmuseum.org/toah/works-of-art/32.69

[Federico B]

Hello folks,

I hope to give my contribution (with my first post on myArmoury) to the Gendarme discussion with a image of the late French men-at-arms, during the reign of Henry IV. As someone affirms that the Henry's cavalry was lighter equipped than its Catholic adversaries; I have found this interest print of an anonymous contemporaneous of Henry's entry on Paris, on the 22th March 1594.



As you can see, the Henry’s cavalry, at least his closed entourage, was equipped with heavy three-quarter armors as the Dutch cuirassiers , and clearly more protected from the early reiters of the French Religions Wars.

This print was published on an old Italian book about Torquato Tasso (he has written three political scripts) published around the 1980, that I have found on my father’s bookshelves.

[Federico B]

Nervermind, I have found the same image on the Henry IV description on English Wikipedia....

[William P]

[Federico B]

Glad to see that the image has its helpfulness.

[Federico B]

By the way, I have re-read the la Noue description of Henry IV gendarmes and, while the description of the armor is quite clear, I have failed to identify a surviving example, especially for the arms protections described. Here the text, that is especially interesting as it explains the thread of the armor decline as thickness and weight increased to protect from the firearms:

Now, if they (the French nobles) perhaps have had good reasons, because of the danger and force of the pistol and musket, to have their armor made stronger and of better material than previously, they have nevertheless so greatly exceed a reasonable measure in this that most of them have loaded on themselves, instead of armor, an entire anvil, so to speak. And with this the handsome aspect of an armored man on horseback has been changed into an ugly monster. For his helmet resemble an iron pot. In his left arm he wears a large iron glove that covered his arm up to the elbow. On his right arm he wears such a poor arm guard that only his shoulder is protected by it. And ordinarily he wears no cuisses. Instead of a blouse, he wears a small round bell jacket, and he carries no spear or lance. Our cuirassiers and light horsemen under King Henry in their times were much more handsome and pleasant to see. They wore their helmets, arm cuisses and greaves, and their blouses, and they carried spear and lance with a banner streaming from the top. This entire armor was so flexible and light that a man might easily wear it for twenty-four hours. But the armor that is commonly worn today is so uncomfortable and heavy that a nobleman thirty-five years old becomes paralyzed in the shoulders under such a heavy burden. In earlier days I have seen the Sire Eguilli and the knight Puigreffier, two honored and famous old men, ride along in front of their companies for a while day, armored from head to foot, whereas now a much younger captain is either unwilling or unable to remain in such situation for only two hours.

[Raman A]

[Daniel Staberg]

That text had little if anything to do with the Gendarmes of Henri IV. La Noue wrote it while a prisoner of the Spanish 1580-1585. It would thus be based on French nobles that La Noue had seen up to 1580 but tells us nothing about the equipment in later years.

You also need to keep in mind that La Noue like most period writers did hesitate to exaggerate to make point. His description is most likely truthfull but does not tell the whole truth. Other sources show that men went into battle both better and worse equipment.

[Daniel Staberg]

[Federico B]