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Jon Butcher





Joined: 22 Dec 2005

Posts: 53

PostPosted: Sun 05 Mar, 2006 9:37 am    Post subject: Cutting Tatami with a Roman Gladius         Reply with quote

I'm not sure where this question should be posted, mods please feel free to move this if appropriate.
I was wondering about the effectiveness of the Roman Gladius as a purely cutting weapon; it's stabbing qualities and uses are well documented, but I wondered if anyone has ever done any tatami cutting with a Gladius and what results were observed ? Is the blade too short or sword too light[ particularly the Mainz pattern] to be effective as a primary cutting weapon ? Obviously the Gladius would have been employed in both ways in combat usage,but is the Gladius capable of cutting tatami [ or limbs] with aclarity ?
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Joel Chesser




Location: Oklahoma
Joined: 23 Oct 2003

Posts: 724

PostPosted: Sun 05 Mar, 2006 2:52 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

I have a Roman Gladius from Kris Cutlery and have tried some pool noodle cutting. It hasn't gone very well, but one must keep in mind, im not sure how to do cutting correctly and my muscles are admitedly pretty weak sauce. AS you said the swords thrust is amazing, no problems there, but the cut isn't what I'd like, could just be me though.
..." The person who dosen't have a sword should sell his coat and buy one."

- Luke 22:36
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Addison C. de Lisle




Location: South Carolina
Joined: 05 Nov 2005
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Posts: 614

PostPosted: Sun 05 Mar, 2006 4:32 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

As I recall, the Roman swords were primarily intended for thrusts, as their phalanx formation didn't allow for much room to be swinging a sword around. So no, it's probably not just you Happy

By the way, how do you test for thrusting ability? Just jab a pool noodle?
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Joel Chesser




Location: Oklahoma
Joined: 23 Oct 2003

Posts: 724

PostPosted: Sun 05 Mar, 2006 9:12 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

I seem to remember reading in this article: http://www.myArmoury.com/feature_spotxviii.html , that Oakeshott thought the type XVIII was used very early in history. I remember reading else where on these forums that he considered Roman type swords to be type XVIII. The type XVIII is a cut and thrust sword. Therefore i personally believe that if it was used in the right hand it could be a very good cutter.
..." The person who dosen't have a sword should sell his coat and buy one."

- Luke 22:36
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Angus Trim




Location: Seattle area
Joined: 26 Aug 2003

Spotlight topics: 1
Posts: 870

PostPosted: Sun 05 Mar, 2006 9:32 pm    Post subject: Re: Cutting Tatami with a Roman Gladius         Reply with quote

Jon Butcher wrote:
I'm not sure where this question should be posted, mods please feel free to move this if appropriate.
I was wondering about the effectiveness of the Roman Gladius as a purely cutting weapon; it's stabbing qualities and uses are well documented, but I wondered if anyone has ever done any tatami cutting with a Gladius and what results were observed ? Is the blade too short or sword too light[ particularly the Mainz pattern] to be effective as a primary cutting weapon ? Obviously the Gladius would have been employed in both ways in combat usage,but is the Gladius capable of cutting tatami [ or limbs] with aclarity ?


Hi John

I made three Glad blades that Erik Stevenson finished. I had one here for a while, and it got used on some Mugen Dachi before a fella named David Wilson of Portland bought it {I think he bought it at this cutting party}.

Went thru the mats like a hot knife thru warmed butter {only faster}, or sh## thru a goose {only cleaner}...........

Depends on who makes the blade..........

swords are fun
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Jon Butcher





Joined: 22 Dec 2005

Posts: 53

PostPosted: Sun 05 Mar, 2006 9:43 pm    Post subject: RE: Cutting Tatami with a Roman Gladius         Reply with quote

"...
Went thru the mats like a hot knife thru warmed butter {only faster}, or sh## thru a goose {only cleaner}...........

Depends on who makes the blade.........."

Thanks Angus, I actually got a chance to see some video [ though I'm not sure where it was from] of Gladius/tatami cutting and the results were dramatic. The Gladius design seems perfectly suited for devestating cuts and I was also surprised by the [apparent] blade prescence. Now if only I can find someone make one for me...
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Felix Wang




Location: Fresno, CA
Joined: 23 Aug 2003
Reading list: 17 books

Spotlight topics: 1
Posts: 394

PostPosted: Mon 06 Mar, 2006 2:02 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

I used to have a First Generation Albion Fulham Gladius. Didn't cut any tatami with it, but did a little light cutting - and it cut very well indeed. Actually, it is more of a chopper than a slicer, but it was devastating on light targets. The notion that the Roman legionaries specialized/prefered thrusting is probably exaggerated. There is just as much literary evidence that the cut/slash/hack was used equally well; and the leafy shape of the Mainz and Fulham designs do lend themselves to cutting.
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Mark Morris





Joined: 16 Sep 2005

Posts: 36

PostPosted: Mon 06 Mar, 2006 3:58 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

I saw a video of someone using an Albion First Generation gladius to test cut Tatami. The sword went through the mat easily. The swordsman even cut on the backswing for a second cut on the same mat. It looked very smooth.
I believe the video was on the ARMA website.

I have read an article (I believe in Military History magazine) that said the gladius would cut off limbs. This article said that the Romans thrust with the sword when in tight formation. When they had room, they went to cutting.
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Mark Morris





Joined: 16 Sep 2005

Posts: 36

PostPosted: Mon 06 Mar, 2006 4:00 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

I forgot to add that I have an Albion Next Generation Mainz gladius.
I have only really hacked around with it. No "official" test cutting. It cuts cardboard like it was "born" to do so.
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