New Danish two-hander? -- myArmoury.com

Ian Hutchison · Posted: Wed 05 Jun, 2013 4:41 pm Post subject: New Danish two-hander?

Hello everyone,

Does anyone have any experience with the outfit/sword in the following link?
http://www.thetimeseller.com/product/6477/0/0...-Sharp.htm

Clearly, in appearance at least, it has taken inspiration from another, more well-known 'Dane'. Still, I might be curious enough to try one but want to see if anyone has anything to say first.

Nathan Robinson · myArmoury Admin

That page shows a rendering of a sword, not a sword. It's clearly a rip off of an Albion. Shame on them.

Ian Hutchison · Posted: Wed 05 Jun, 2013 7:13 pm Post subject:

T. Kew · Posted: Thu 06 Jun, 2013 1:30 am Post subject:

The specifications look revealing. The "Danish Montante":

While the Dane itself:

So it looks like a longer and significantly heavier clone, probably (I would guess) due to having simplified the blade geometry and lost some details of the taper and so on.[/url]

Marik C.S. · Posted: Thu 06 Jun, 2013 1:49 am Post subject:

I think this might be the same sword but also shows some detail photos. Though somewhere on the road to copying that sword it must have turned into an oversized bastard sword judging by the description - which most likely was also just copied form another sword on that site.

Wouldn't be the first blatant clone sword sold there if I remember correctly - there were some while browsing the catalogue that look awfully familiar - but what makes matters worse is that this shop has a certain - albeit in terms of historically accurate weaponry pretty lousy - reputation, being one of the few resellers of Coldsteel and other popular brands in Germany.

Daniel Wallace · Posted: Thu 06 Jun, 2013 8:12 am Post subject:

the first things that would catch my concern is clearly the cg rendering of the sword. this makes me believe the sword has not yet been produced, or is in a planning stage.

furthermore, i know this is a dealer of sorts, but the description alone of 'Montante' directs me to another portion of the family of two handed swords. what? a Danish Iberian two handed sword??

albeit, each culture that adopted the two handed sword have their own term in their own language to describe repetitively the same sword aside from minute differences in blade style and hilt configurations.

Matthew P. Adams · Posted: Thu 06 Jun, 2013 9:06 am Post subject:

Not to stir up a hornets nest but what makes this a copy of the Albion Dane and not a replica of a danish long sword?

http://www.myArmoury.com/talk/viewtopic.php?t=20008

From the historic examples given it looks to me like it could be its own replica, the bound grip, faceted pommel, and cross all seem typical of the sword type, and the blade also. I'm not saying it doesn't have a striking resemblance to the Dane, but wouldn't any sword based on the type look fairly similar?

Luka Borscak · Posted: Thu 06 Jun, 2013 9:15 am Post subject:

They seem to be based in Spain so "Danish montante" is just their way of saying "Danish twohander" probably. Happy

On the other hand, it worries me that they list many old Windlass models and they admit they are out of stock but it also says "available for order". I doubt that.

Eric W. Norenberg · Posted: Thu 06 Jun, 2013 3:37 pm Post subject:

[quote="Matthew P. Adams"]Not to stir up a hornets nest but what makes this a copy of the Albion Dane and not a replica of a danish long sword?

http://www.myArmoury.com/talk/viewtopic.php?t=20008
quote]

Just glancing at the surviving originals, there is enough variety within that readily identifiable family that any maker who wanted to do a "big late medieval Scandinavian two-hander" has plenty of design choices to distinguish theirs from another maker's work. Actually the Albion Dane is a little short in the grip (look at the blade-to-grip length proportions), compared to many originals. Replicating this end of the family "spectrum", along with the other similarities, convinces me that their inspiration comes more from Wisconsin than from Denmark.

Even the relative widths and spacing of the wire wraps mimic the Albion model. I wonder if the real thing will be faithful to their rendering... If it proves to be of passable quality I'll be a bit bummed that they did not choose to replicate something different from this same family of swords, it is a fascinating group that deserves more attention, both in aesthetics and the usage implications.

Ian Hutchison · Posted: Thu 06 Jun, 2013 4:36 pm Post subject:

[quote="Eric W. Norenberg"]

Eric W. Norenberg · Posted: Thu 06 Jun, 2013 8:41 pm Post subject:

Oh yeah, thank you Ian, I missed that somehow. It does look pretty well put together. Any idea who the actual maker is? If the price were a bit closer to the usual "kit bash" Windlass range it might be tempting... I'd slap a small spherical pommel on it, a wider curved cross, and maybe move the cross down a bit, shoot for a 2:1 blade-to-grip proportion... Then buy some pumpkins or melons and try to figure out how to best swing the thing!

-Eric

William Swiger · Posted: Thu 06 Jun, 2013 8:41 pm Post subject:

Just for the heck of it, I added an old discontinued Windlass model to the cart that was listed as available for order just to see shipping costs. I did not order it but they e-mailed me the same day saying the model was no longer available for sale.

Appears they do not keep their site updated.

Ian Hutchison · Posted: Thu 06 Jun, 2013 8:57 pm Post subject:

Matthew P. Adams · Posted: Thu 06 Jun, 2013 9:05 pm Post subject:

Yeah, those wire wraps. Ok, I'm convinced they took insperation from Wisconsin. I just like giving the benefit of the doubt but having basically identical wire wrap widths and spacing put it over the edge.

Marik C.S. · Posted: Fri 07 Jun, 2013 3:12 am Post subject:

Daniel Wallace · Posted: Fri 07 Jun, 2013 8:34 am Post subject:

from one maker to another, weather it is production or a personal commission, there should always be an attempt to make a variety. or in the very least, an identifiable contrast between two companies products.

true, that if two makers look at the same historical sword, and base their model on that work, they will come up with something very similar, if not a match to each others work. but within this rather small collecting niche of the world, you would think that you would develop a product and think, 'hey our sword looks very close to another on the market, maybe we should make it a little different.'

although i do not believe this is the idea behind the company we are discussing here, in my opinion they probably looked at the Dane and like it, made a similar looking sword, for a different price (I'm sorry i did not convert the Euro as i began to write this) but, their sword is different enough from the Albion product. Albion makes their swords to a quality of use, and historical accuracy. the geometry of the sword is going to be different the balance of it will be different, the materials will be different. so even though the swords look alike, that's all it is, they are not truly alike.

Eric W. Norenberg · Posted: Fri 07 Jun, 2013 8:52 am Post subject:

Right in front of my nose, on the "Time Seller" web page- I'm guessing its made by "Urs Velunt", whom I've not heard of before, but they can be found on a few other websites. The rendered pic of the sword even seems to show their makers mark, a bear's paw and anvil, next to the fullered ricasso. Every other sword made by them that I have found is a blunt, so maybe this is a special edition "sharp" that the maker is producing for one or two specific retailers (just guessing here again).

Anybody have any experience with Urs Velunt?

Matthew P. Adams · Posted: Sun 16 Feb, 2014 7:49 pm Post subject:

http://sbg-sword-store.sword-buyers-guide.com/product268.html

Looks like it has a full wire wrap now?