[Mark Mattimore]

I have admired the weapons and armor in the "Arms and Armour" section over at By The Sword (www.by-the-sword.com) and have been considering making a purchase for some time now. I was wondering if anyone has experience or first-hand knowledge of these items or their manufacture. The site describes the maker as European but nothing else. I contacted By The Sword directly and they told me that they were contractually forbidden from revealing the source. The items appear to be of high quality and they do carry a premium price point.

So has anyone ever handled this stuff or know who is making it? I am really interested in several pieces but want to get some opinions before I buy. Thanks in advance.

[Aaron Schnatterly]

I've looked as well. It's a personal matter, of course, dependant upon a ton of factors. Some of the pieces look decent, but for me, I definitely won't - and here are my reasons.

1) I don't know the source. Yeah, you pointed this out, and are inquiring yourself, so you have the same uneasy feeling, too.

2) I don't want a piece in my personal collection that couldn't be used. These may be perfectly suitable, but I don't know, and I don't have a source (therefore a reputation) to go by.

3) I don't want a piece in my personal collection that I couldn't actually use - similar to #2, but I like custom work to fit me, not the average person. That's not to say that munitions armour isn't good, but it never seemed to fit me just right. To ensure this, I like to be able to discuss details with whomever is making the piece - better yet, get them to measure me.

4) There are armourers that are producing quality pieces for near that price. I'll go with someone I know and trust, or have heard good things about from people I trust, or someone I have personally seen pieces by.

5) Guarantee, or issues of repair, refurbishment, etc.

If I were looking for something to put on a stand in the corner of my office and dust once in a while, there are lots of options out there. I've got a lot more interest in actual use and functionality. My dollar (more like $5000, give or take for a harness) will go to a name and face, a hand I can shake.

This is my personal opinion based upon my needs and my preferences.

[Edward Hitchens]

If a distributor refuses to disclose a manufacturer, that would be an instant turn-off to me. Aaron's right: If you wanted to do some research to find out if a maker's products are good or not, where would you start? That would also make me question the relations between the maker and the distributor. If the items "carry a premium price point," all the more reason I'd want to know more. In other words, if I'm going to give a company a large sum of money for a product, then I'd want them to be able to give me the answers that I'd need.

Just my .02 worth.
Ted

[Joe Fults]

Businesses make private label agreements and negotiate terms of nondisclosure with manufacturers all the time. Its actually pretty common at retail. However, most of the time the consumer is given a measure of assurance that they are buying quality based on the goodwill and brand power of the retailer. Its why we see WalMart, Kroger, and other house brands next to everything from P&G, Clorox, and Colgate Palmolive.

Question is do you trust the "By-the-Sword" brand enough to buy something you might not buy direct from the manufacturer?

I'm going with Aaron and Ed on this one.

[Nathan Robinson]

Good response, Joe. I'll just add that I'm guessing that By-the-Sword is hoping to build the product's reputation themselves, so that their own sales will create a user-base of opinions. This is a slow route to go, of course.

[Andrew Kephart]

Hi, new member, the stuff at by the sword looks like it comes from maybe a couple of different Czech armourers, my guess is Arms and Armour Manufacture, I used to have their website but lost it. Hope this helps, that is strange that they can't give you any clue who made. By the by, I'm in the process of having a black and white harness made by Jiri Klepac, a Czech armourer who does restoration work at local museums, here's a link to his site: www.armour.cz

Andrew

[Aaron Schnatterly]

[Joe Fults]

[Aaron Schnatterly]

[Steve Grisetti]

[Mark Mattimore]

My thanks to everyone for their opinions. I agree that any purchase of this stuff is a big risk. Even though I’m not looking for fully customized armor, I don’t want something that is one-size-fits-all generic either. This stuff seems to be nicely made but the lack of information still makes me very wary.

As for the issue of BTS’s reputation being a factor, I have purchased from them before and have always been very pleased. But that is more of a service issue and not one of product quality. BTS sells a lot of good quality items from Windlass, Lutel and others but also deals in what I would consider lesser-quality stuff. So it could go either way.

Andrew, I think you may be right that the maker is Arms and Armor Manufacture. I found there website here http://www.arms-armor.cz. Much of the stuff looks the same although I think the pictures on BTS are actually better.

So I still don’t know. I’ll probably keep my money and buy from an armourer with more of a reputation. But who knows. Thanks for the feedback.

[Shane Allee]

I really have no clue, but one possible reason for not disclosing a manufacture name is because it might not be made all in one shop. I seem to recall one place that I think was in the Czech republic that would sell arms and armor made by various craftsmen around the area, there wasn't any factory or anything where they all worked. They might also be buying wares from various small set-ups all over europe. Or they may simply just not want other companies to be able to use the same manufacturer, then undersell them. If a company invest money into having a manufacturer develope products, it can be easy sometimes for other companys to come in and take advantage of the work and investment of the other company. Infinite possibilities though...

Shane

[Joe Fults]

[Steve Fabert]

[Mark Mattimore]