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Pieter B.





Joined: 16 Feb 2014
Reading list: 10 books

Posts: 577

PostPosted: Mon 17 Feb, 2014 7:50 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Not related to the weapons they use but the ship they sail on is most definitely not accurate.

The ship appears to be an an east indiaman or perhaps a navy frigate.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons...r-2005.jpg

While the east indiaman (merchant) was certainly a target of pirates they would never use one of them for the act of piracy. They are simply to big and slow for typical pirate and required decent logistics to maintain.

Most pirates operated in sloops,schooners and such types.

Only around four pirates in the golden age of piracy used a ship nearing the size of a frigate or an actual frigate. Blackbeard being one of them. However none of these pirates used the ship longer than 5 years since they could not maintain them or they proved to be inadequate for quick escaped to shoals and other hideouts.

However assuming flint has the crew and logistics required to operate his ship for any moment of time he would have made some adjustments to his ship.

http://pixel.nymag.com/content/dam/daily/vult...-sails.jpg
The place where he is standing serves quite well as an arena type environment for cinematic viewing pleasure but is an obstacle in ship boarding attacks.

Pirates often cut away all superstructures on the deck of their ship to provide a large even fighting ground. They removed the fore castle and sometimes even the aft deck, this in turn also lowers the weight of the ship.

http://static.squarespace.com/static/50a02efc...ossxm3.jpg

That said I do appreciate that they chose to have a big pirate ship anyways because it's more fun to watch.
If I were a real pirate however I would preferable sail with this:

http://wafilmworks.files.wordpress.com/2012/0...ngton1.jpg

than this:

http://assets.nydailynews.com/polopoly_fs/1.1...-2014.jpg[
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Lin Robinson




Location: NC
Joined: 15 Jun 2006
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PostPosted: Mon 17 Feb, 2014 12:44 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Kel Rekuta wrote:
The show seems to be dated within a couple years after the first Jacobite Rebellion in 1715 according to some dialogue in the third episode. I don't know how that might relate to the accuracy of clothing and props as its not my period of study.

The show is a good romp so I will continue to watch it. Wink


Kel...

The first Jacobite Rebellion was in 1689 and the second in 1708 - although since no real fighting took place in 1708 it is hard to refer to it as a rebellion. "The '15" was actually the third attempt to put the Stuarts back on the throne of Great Britain.

Lin Robinson

"The best thing in life is to crush your enemies, see them driven before you and hear the lamentation of their women." Conan the Barbarian, 1982
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Kel Rekuta




Location: Toronto, Canada
Joined: 10 Feb 2004
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Posts: 603

PostPosted: Mon 17 Feb, 2014 10:55 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Lin Robinson wrote:
Kel Rekuta wrote:
The show seems to be dated within a couple years after the first Jacobite Rebellion in 1715 according to some dialogue in the third episode. I don't know how that might relate to the accuracy of clothing and props as its not my period of study.

The show is a good romp so I will continue to watch it. Wink


Kel...

The first Jacobite Rebellion was in 1689 and the second in 1708 - although since no real fighting took place in 1708 it is hard to refer to it as a rebellion. "The '15" was actually the third attempt to put the Stuarts back on the throne of Great Britain.


Hmmm. The dialogue went "The news from Edinborough is that James is fled to France and they are calling him the Pretender." I agree we should revise this to sometime after 1702. I cannot describe the rebellion against the Covenent as Jacobite as James II had not been cast aside for another yet. And of course the 1708 rebellion was still born.

Good points... we've shaved it down another decade for arguments' sake. Does that make the trouser buttons more or less likely then? Razz
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Lin Robinson




Location: NC
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PostPosted: Wed 19 Feb, 2014 7:19 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Kel...

The Rebellion of 1689 was a response to the Glorious Revolution, which forced James off the throne in favor of his sister Mary, the wife of William of Orange. James left England in December, 1688. It was the first Jacobite Rebellion. The Covenant was just one issue in this history and parliament, in 1701, passed the Act of Succession, which laid out who would sit on the throne of Great Britain. James Stuart was not on that list. I assume that the Act of Succession is what the actors are referring to but if so, and it is 1702, then they are discussing something which happened fourteen years past.

I agree that 1708 was not much of an attempt but James did sail to Scotland with the French fleet, which was ultimately chased off by the timely arrival of ships under Admiral Sir George Byng, ending the expedition.

If you would like to read more, I have an article in an upcoming issue of The Highlander about this rebellion and also the one which took place in 1719 and involved some actual fighting. Last year they printed one on James Graham and the rebellion of 1689 that I also wrote.

Lin Robinson

"The best thing in life is to crush your enemies, see them driven before you and hear the lamentation of their women." Conan the Barbarian, 1982
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Kel Rekuta




Location: Toronto, Canada
Joined: 10 Feb 2004
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Posts: 603

PostPosted: Wed 19 Feb, 2014 8:44 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Lin,

Thanks for the clarification. As I mentioned, its not really my area of study and my recollection of what I've read is more fuzzy than I thought. Blush
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J. Hargis




Location: Pacific Palisades, California
Joined: 06 Feb 2012
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PostPosted: Wed 19 Feb, 2014 11:14 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

I know that pirates were most likely tough, harsh talking SOBs, but the language in this series seems all too contemporary. Perhaps the writers thought that such language would make it more appealing to the intended audience. But IMO, it just seems so over-the-top modern day crude. Rather like 'Reservoir Dogs' with accents & boats.

Or perhaps I've lived in southern California a little too long.

Jon

A poorly maintained weapon is likely to belong to an unsafe and careless fighter.
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Jaroslav Jakubov




Location: Slovakia
Joined: 26 Aug 2008

Posts: 48

PostPosted: Wed 19 Feb, 2014 12:23 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Actually, this show is based on book Porto Bello Gold written by Arthur D. Howden Smith, which is supposed to be a prequel to famous Robert Louis Stevenson's Treasure Island.

In that book, two pirate captains planned the action, Flint, and Andrew Murray, Scottish patriot who wanted to use money to fund another attempt to take the British throne for Stuarts. Both ships are mentioned in book being large doubledecker Frigates (40 guns), Flint's ship Walrus was indeed Indiaman captured by him while on way to Smyrna.

I have read that book several times when i was a boy, still have it, so i was quite happy about seeing the TV Show based on it.. but was quite disappointed they completely thrown away Murray, and made Flint the mastermind planning the action... in the book, Flint was just a rough drunkard, while John Silver did all the intrigues...
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