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Leo Todeschini
Industry Professional
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Posted: Tue 10 Sep, 2013 10:39 am Post subject: Type IV hollow bronze mace reproduction |
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HI All,
Kiripichnikov, a Russian academic put together a great paper on mace types found in Russia and many of these were found along the trade routes as you would expect. These routes largely followed the rivers of course and many of these were used by the Rus Vikings on the way back and forth to Byzantium. This has meant that the Type IV mace which was contemporary with the Rus Vikings has come to be associated with Byzantium and perhaps used by the Varangian guard.
These early type IV maces had the 4 prominent pyramids along the equator of the mace and and the 8 'half pyramids' along the top and bottom that define the type IV. However they also have rows of decorative beading strung around the pyramids and were usually solid.
These early type IV maces ran from around 8th -11thC.
After this they seem to migrate toward Europe and at the same time they lose the beading. As solid maces, the spikes cannot protrude too much or the weight would become too high to wield, so they often start to become hollow. Being hollow allows the spikes to become larger and that ends up with a mace similar to this one.
Maces similar to this have been found all over Europe and 2 14thC examples have been found in the UK.
I am almost certain I saw a French Army issue mace of type IV pattern that was issued in the 19thC, so if this is the case, the same basic design ran for 1200 years.
The mounted mace shown here is 83mm across, cast in bronze and complete weighs 435g = less than 1lb.
Anyway I hope you like the result.
Tod
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Jack Smith
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Posted: Wed 11 Sep, 2013 9:06 am Post subject: |
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nice!it is so amazing that a design can survive for 1200 years.
Alea iacta est.
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Boris Bedrosov
Industry Professional
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Posted: Wed 11 Sep, 2013 10:28 am Post subject: |
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Jack Smith wrote: | ....it is so amazing that a design can survive for 1200 years. |
"The perfection DOES NOT need any change"
In any way, Leo has done very good work, as always.
I personally, never tried Type IV so far. My experience is only with Type I.
"Everyone who has the right to wear a long sword, has to remember that his sword is his soul,
and he has to separate from it when he separates from his life"
Tokugawa Ieyasu
Find my works on Facebook:
Boris Bedrosov's Armoury
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Mark Griffin
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Posted: Wed 11 Sep, 2013 11:46 am Post subject: |
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Yep, I have some british and french trench maces, almost identical and has been pointed out, work just as well.
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Danny Grigg
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Posted: Fri 13 Sep, 2013 11:45 pm Post subject: |
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Tod
Great looking mace, what's the overall length of the weapon including the haft?
So just to confirm the weight you quoted includes the haft and the mace head?
Can anyone tell me if Kiripichnikov's work on maces is readily available and in English?
I would love to pick up a copy.
There is very little published information on maces.
Thanks
Danny
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Boris Bedrosov
Industry Professional
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Posted: Sat 14 Sep, 2013 1:50 pm Post subject: |
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Danny Grigg wrote: | ......Can anyone tell me if Kiripichnikov's work on maces is readily available and in English?
I would love to pick up a copy...... |
Unfortunately, I've never heard so.
As far as I know (and I have some of his works, including on maces, in this language), they could be found only in Russian.
"Everyone who has the right to wear a long sword, has to remember that his sword is his soul,
and he has to separate from it when he separates from his life"
Tokugawa Ieyasu
Find my works on Facebook:
Boris Bedrosov's Armoury
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David Lewis Smith
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Posted: Sat 14 Sep, 2013 2:10 pm Post subject: |
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As one word responses are not allowed, I want to state
Nope
Nope, I do not want face either of these across the field or list.
As far as the mace it self, Tod, I think you did a fantastic job, I love the brutal simplicity of your mace I like the haft that is with out embellishment or decoration. The whole thing comes together
Nope, not wanting to get hit with that
Might want to add one to my collection though..
David L Smith
MSG (RET)
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Ben Sweet
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Posted: Sat 14 Sep, 2013 5:25 pm Post subject: |
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That was a style of mace I just never cared for till now, fantastic on the new made!
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Aaron Hoard
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Posted: Sun 15 Sep, 2013 1:56 pm Post subject: |
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I really like the looks of that.
I have one of his Early Medieval maces (Mace 2) and it's slowly becoming one of the favorite things in my collection.
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Danny Grigg
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Posted: Sun 15 Sep, 2013 4:22 pm Post subject: |
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Boris Bedrosov wrote: | Danny Grigg wrote: | ......Can anyone tell me if Kiripichnikov's work on maces is readily available and in English?
I would love to pick up a copy...... |
Unfortunately, I've never heard so.
As far as I know (and I have some of his works, including on maces, in this language), they could be found only in Russian. |
Boris thanks for the response.
So I don't suppose there's been an Osprey book that summarises Kirpichnikov's typology similar to the typologies of Jan Petersen in the book Viking Hersir 793-1066 AD (Warrior 3)?
Danny
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Boris Bedrosov
Industry Professional
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Posted: Mon 16 Sep, 2013 1:04 pm Post subject: |
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I've never seen such Osprey book.
BTW, in some degree Eastern and South-Eastern Medieval Europe (including Rus) are somewhat neglected there - this is my own opinion, of course.
"Everyone who has the right to wear a long sword, has to remember that his sword is his soul,
and he has to separate from it when he separates from his life"
Tokugawa Ieyasu
Find my works on Facebook:
Boris Bedrosov's Armoury
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David Lewis Smith
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Posted: Mon 16 Sep, 2013 1:52 pm Post subject: |
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With some gentile reminding I will try to scan some photos from a Russian book I have with examples from several museums. I will do my best to translate as well. Truth, my Russian is terrible and I forget many words.
Правда, я понимаю русский язык ужасно
David L Smith
MSG (RET)
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Leo Todeschini
Industry Professional
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Jean Thibodeau
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Posted: Wed 18 Sep, 2013 1:31 am Post subject: |
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Leo Todeschini wrote: | Thanks very much guys - really appreciate the comments.
Tod |
Well I want to add my appreciation for the beauty of the complex shape of the mace head that is sort of hypnotic to caress with the eyes as should be all good sculpture.
I guess we have to give due credit to the period makers of similar designs, but you did a beautiful job of making a nice crisply executed piece.
You can easily give up your freedom. You have to fight hard to get it back!
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Christian Borglum
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Posted: Tue 24 Sep, 2013 8:38 pm Post subject: |
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Hi Tod,
Very nice little basher! Those type IVs seem like the evolutionary pipinnacle of the compact knobbed mace. Your's reminds me of this one from the Legermseum in Delft. It sure seems like it'd be a shame to only cast one of these. Do you have any plans for perhaps adding the type IV to your line of maces available from The English Cutler??
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Leo Todeschini
Industry Professional
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