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Gregory J. Liebau




Location: Dinuba, CA
Joined: 27 Nov 2004

Posts: 669

PostPosted: Thu 20 Jun, 2013 6:21 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Peteris R. wrote:
Kinda off topic here, but do you guys think it's a sound choice to start with lower end products? I am just aspiring as a reenactor, and I really don't have much of an idea what I'm getting into - hence why I am not too willing to spend too much outright.


It's like getting into anything else... If you were to try out fly fishing would you go straight for the several thousand dollar carbon fiber pole? No... Test the waters! Reenacting is first and foremost a social activity, and although a lot of stress is placed on having quality equipment, that is a secondary matter to the interactivity. What if you get to your first camping event with $10,000 of equipment and decide you hate camping and that all of the people around you are history snobs who you'd never want to hang out with again in your life?

Start out frugally, don't buy a lot of crappy stuff - just enough to get by - and if you enjoy yourself then you can rather quickly move on to more serious investments.

-Gregory
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Sean Flynt




Location: Birmingham, Alabama
Joined: 21 Aug 2003
Likes: 10 pages
Reading list: 13 books

Spotlight topics: 7
Posts: 5,981

PostPosted: Thu 20 Jun, 2013 7:43 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

I've acquired almost everything I have through trade, bargain hunting and my own research and handwork (and selling same). My collection is very small, but it started from Windlass/MRL and still includes some better Windlass parts. I have an E.B. Erickson Hauswehr, A&A Town Guard, A&A Milanese Rapier and dagger set, a Windlass-based bastard sword and a Tod's stuff kit knife. I have four or five projects in the works with decent parts, including an A&A Dürer/Schloss Erbach mashup and various HT, Windlass and A&A parts and blades. I have no idea which of those projects, if any, will become a cherished part of my little collection. I'll learn something from all of them.

As much as I covet my neighbor's collection, if I had the means to just call A&A or Albion and buy one of everything I wouldn't do it. I get most of my fun from the chase--researching, scrounging parts, developing skills, etc. I'd buy a few things new, I'm sure, because those folks work hard to educate us and supply us with outstanding examples of the art.

Some might think I'm a sword flipper rather than a sword slipper because I sell so many of my projects. I do that not because I'm out for profit (which is impossible if you figure a fair hourly wage) but because most of my interest is in the journey rather than the destination, and in the knowledge rather than the product. At some point I realized that if I stuck that money into a PayPal account as it came back to me I would have enough for a great used sword AND still have all of the acquired historical/technological/practical knowledge.

Not everybody has or wants a workshop or large research library. So consider this: If, every time I saw a cheap sword or great book I wanted, I had simply set aside that much cash in an envelope, I would have had enough for a fine sword very quickly. I wouldn't be able to fully appreciate the piece, but I'd have it quickly. Even at MRL Deal of the Day prices, a few swords at $150 would get you in range of some of the best deals to be found on the Marketplace here. That would actually give you more than the $400 I paid for my A&A Dürer (current new price $1011). I recently saw an A&A German Bastard Sword go for $500 (current new price $1013). I skipped that GBS and picked up the A&A Milanese Rapier and dagger/sheath set for $600 (current new price $1576). That doesn't help A&A directly, but for me and many others the choice is not between a new fine sword and a used one. The new ones are simply out of reach in this economy.

Now, if I could afford a standing annual order with Eljay Erickson, that would be a different story.

-Sean

Author of the Little Hammer novel

https://www.amazon.com/Little-Hammer-Sean-Flynt/dp/B08XN7HZ82/ref=sr_1_1?dchild=1&keywords=little+hammer+book&qid=1627482034&sr=8-1
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Daniel Wallace




Location: Pennsylvania USA
Joined: 07 Aug 2011

Posts: 580

PostPosted: Thu 20 Jun, 2013 8:14 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

i remember starting out collecting. knives came first, like anyone else i went for the inexpensive stuff that looked cool, and i kept my purchases to a minimum so i wouldn't overload myself. usually a United cutlery piece. my first sword was my high school graduation present my dad actually got it for me. at the time i though a $100 for a sword was a ton of money but i practically worshiped the thing and it's been on my wall ever since - refuse to get rid of it. i picked up another inexpensive wall hanger a few years later and got disgusted that it was a rat tail junk - in the mean time my friend kept on getting the same things and i was just never satisfied with the wall hanger market.

then i graduated college, by this time my knowledge of blade smithing was better than average, and i went all over the place to find a real blacksmith at a ren fair and wound up all the way in Detroit where i met Jim Hrisoulas (never knew who he was until later) i picked up one of his swords and it was like a different dimension - then i saw the price and was like wo - i can't buy this thing, i've never spent that much money in my life. but good ol' dad saw my eyes light up when i held it and told me it was my grad present lol.

after that i've completely abandoned the wall hanger market and anything that is not full tang, i was thinking about the museum replica's German bastard sword for a while, but went with A&A instead and never looked back at that other sword again once i got it. true i don't think you should break your bank account at first until you begin to understand the sword a little more, but once your ready - go after an A&A, Albion, Del tin etc. as long as you find the right market for them, they will always hold their value better. they are also safer if you chose to drill with them if you get that involved with it.
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Chad Arnow
myArmoury Team


myArmoury Team

PostPosted: Thu 20 Jun, 2013 9:03 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Peteris R. wrote:
Kinda off topic here, but do you guys think it's a sound choice to start with lower end products? I am just aspiring as a reenactor, and I really don't have much of an idea what I'm getting into - hence why I am not too willing to spend too much outright.


From a cost standpoint, starting off with low-end pieces may be a bad idea if you're like me. I have bought and sold a lot of lower end things through the years and have lost money on most.

However, what I learned from each has been substantial and probably worth the cost. From the long-since-sold first cheap Depeeka pieces I owned, I learned that sword-shaped objects are not enough; I want functional, well-constructed historical pieces by people who know their craft. From a now-sold Hanwei rapier, I learned I don't like rapiers enough to have them in my smallish collection. From a now-sold Del Tin viking sword, I learned my wishes for a Viking sword are higher than my budget. Etc., etc.

Every purchase is a learning experience. You may learn that you made a great choice--or not. Happy If you compare it to cars, can you really fully appreciate the world's finest automobile (whatever you think that is) if you don't really know what makes it better than the rest (whatever that is)?

Going straight to high-end stuff might be better if you know exactly what you want and get it right the first time. If you're still learning, lower-end pieces might be a great way to decide what's really important to you.

Happy

ChadA

http://chadarnow.com/
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Lewis Ballard




Location: Houston, TX
Joined: 27 Dec 2009

Posts: 66

PostPosted: Thu 20 Jun, 2013 9:33 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Chad Arnow wrote:
(Snip)

Going straight to high-end stuff might be better if you know exactly what you want and get it right the first time. If you're still learning, lower-end pieces might be a great way to decide what's really important to you.


Very well said! I was trying to formulate something along those lines, but you phrased that very well.
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P. Schontzler




Location: WA, USA
Joined: 15 Apr 2013

Posts: 99

PostPosted: Thu 20 Jun, 2013 10:04 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

My first sword was a nice Del Tin hand-half. Although it may not be a top-tier piece, I don't consider it "sub-par," since it really is a functional, historically-inspired sword. However, had I started out with a lower quality sword I probably would have regretted the purchase in the long run. I am very glad I waited and saved a bit to get a "real" sword. As my collection will almost certainly grow I will seek higher end pieces that will overshadow the Del Tin but I will always keep it.
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Sean Flynt




Location: Birmingham, Alabama
Joined: 21 Aug 2003
Likes: 10 pages
Reading list: 13 books

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PostPosted: Thu 20 Jun, 2013 10:11 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Yeah, it would not be a good feeling to get an Albion Svante as your first sword, only to find out that you really prefer golf.

My standing advice to folks who just have a vague sense that they want a sword is to think not just about their budget, but also about their tastes, personality, historical interests and family/cultural origins. I think you need to consider all of those factors to feel connected with the piece and be happy with the purchase. The point being that if you're a 6'5", blond-haired, blue-eyed, third-generation Minnesotan named Gjerstad, you might be happier in the long term with the Albion Hersir at $1,430 than you would be with the A&A smallsword at $580.

-Sean

Author of the Little Hammer novel

https://www.amazon.com/Little-Hammer-Sean-Flynt/dp/B08XN7HZ82/ref=sr_1_1?dchild=1&keywords=little+hammer+book&qid=1627482034&sr=8-1
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Ken Jay




Location: Portland Oregon
Joined: 23 Aug 2003

Posts: 141

PostPosted: Fri 21 Jun, 2013 1:44 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Perhaps this is a case of "better being the enemy of good enough?" Weighing how many "sub-par" swords equals one good sword seems silly. What makes a better sword? Does it have to be an Albion or custom to be better? With the limited numbers of surviving original pieces do we have a clear sense of the quality of most swords through history. My guess is that Windless/MRL/Henwai pieces might well stack up to the average historical sword. So buy what you like and can afford and be happy with it! It's not like we really need to worry about actually using the sword for serious social purposes. Big Grin
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Gregory J. Liebau




Location: Dinuba, CA
Joined: 27 Nov 2004

Posts: 669

PostPosted: Fri 21 Jun, 2013 9:53 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Chad Arnow wrote:

Going straight to high-end stuff might be better if you know exactly what you want and get it right the first time. If you're still learning, lower-end pieces might be a great way to decide what's really important to you.


Just wanted to note that Peteris mentioned he's an aspiring reenactor. That's very different than being a collector. Reenacting is an activity, and even if you started out with everything you wanted at that time being handed out on a silver platter, one might still wind up disliking the reenactment experience, or finding that it is too time-consuming, etc... The concern for cost-savings at an early stage in the reenactment hobby should be serious. Half of the money spent on an event may wind up being on petroleum and food, notwithstanding the cost of equipment. One's mood towards the hobby can change dramatically after some experience, and however fancy the sword is that's hanging at the hip probably won't make a difference.

-Gregory
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