[George Hill]

Has anyone ever seen armor for the legs of a horse? Espeically the front legs?

[Russ Thomas]

A very good question ! The German armourer Kunz Lochner ( ob. 1567), is known to have made a horse armour that went all the way down to the feet, though unfortunately none of this armour survives. I seem to remember seeing a sort of horses greave somewhere, but off the top of my head I cannot honestly remember where, though it may well have been oriental, Persian or something ? The best place to look would be in 'Stones glossary of the use and decoration of arms and armour', if it exists, or existed, it is quite probably in there. I will have a hunt around and see what I can come up with

Regards as ever,

Russ

The famous Augsburg armourer Lorenz Helmschmied (ob.1516), made a complete head to foot harness for a horse for the Duke of Burgandy ( the future Emperor Maximillian I ), again no pieces of this survive, but there is evidently a painting showing the emperor on a horse which is wearing this armour. It is in the Kunst Historisches Museum , Vienna.

R.

[Gordon Frye]

George, I'll have to agree with Russ that although there is some, there just wasn't much. ffolkes shows some in "The Armourer and his Art" (which offhand I think is either Helmschmied or Lochner, not sure which if either) but for the most part it wasn't bothered with.

Most of the danger to a horse in combat is from either projectile weapons (especially arrows and quarrels) and pole-arms. The crupper and flanks cover the hind end of the horse to protect from dropping arrows (which was the favorite way of the English for dealing with French cavalry: send LOTS of arrows on a high arc to drop onto the horses from above), while the peytral and chamfron protect the horse's breast and fore-head from pole-arms. The crinolet protects his neck from slashes from above.

There was of course the heavy Oriental Horse such as in the form of the Cataphracts that draped maille over their horses (and was later copied by the Crusaders, I do believe) that would provide a great deal of protection for the legs of the horses from various weapons. In fact the simple cloth caparison would go a long ways towards this as well.

The main threat that might come to a horses legs would be from a footman with a sword, but my impression is that since the primary tactic of cavalry is to thunder down on infantry in a solid line with lances bristling, there isn't much opportunity for any footman to leap out of harm's way and cut down the horse's legs with a great sword, a la Hollywood. He might leap out of the way of one horse, and into the path of another. He ought to land about 15+ feet away.

I hope that this in some way helps you with your question.

Cheers,

Gordon

[George Hill]

[Hisham Gaballa]

This probably not what you had in mind, but it is horse armour, and it does partially cover the horse's legs .



The picture is from "An Historical Guide to Arms and Armour" by Stephen Bull and Tony North.

[Gordon Frye]

Cool pic, Hisham!

Here's another one, nabbed from the thread on the Frazier Museum elsewhere on this forum, of a representation of an English Knight in full kit, with his horse in a full length Caparison.

Cheers!

Gordon

[Jean Thibodeau]

Gordon;

How would a horse react or tolerate wearing a Caparison which may have been padded like a Gambison as far as heat dissipation: I guess the horse wouldn't have much choice about it, but an overheated horse might not perform well on a battlefield.

Leg armour might also have a greater negative effect on the horse, increasing fatigue, than an equal weight of armour distributed elsewhere on the horses' body.

Leg armour might also be difficult to strap to a horses' legs securely without overtightening and if loose at all would be very annoying to the horse.

A long maille or scale skirt might be a better solution.

[Gordon Frye]

Jean;

From my experience with horses, I would say that they'll get used to whatever it is you train them to deal with, but if it isn't fitted "just so" I think that articulated plate armour would be a serious pain for a horse to have to deal with. As if you don't have enough distractions on the battlefield for a horse to deal with.

I suppose that heat would be an issue to some degree, but again, something to train the horse to. Giving them plenty of water of course, and not running them all over creation on a lark. I suspect that this is one of the reasons that "light horse" who's task it was to screen and skirmish, never used such encumbrances (aside from the weight issue).

I agree that a mail skirt is probably a good workable solution if you really feel the need for protecting the horses legs. The weight would be quite a burden, but if used without padding (over the legs at least) would be cooler for certain. Otherwise the padding that Hasham posted, or just cloth to slow things down a tad, as with a caparison.

Cheers!

Gordon

[David R. Glier]

Heck, just dump water over the thing before you really get going. Nice and cool, constantly evaporating, constantly wicking away sweat... The horse will LOVE it, especially if it spends most of its time in the stables.

And the horse will also enjoy wearing a big comfy sweater on those icky cold days in the spring, fall and winter.

[Patrick Kelly]

Gordon,

How big of an issue is abrasion with this kind of stuff ? I have friends who do a lot of riding (never had a real opportunity to myself unfortunately) and it seems that saddle sores can be an issue. I'd think that all of that metal would just compound the problem.

[Gordon Frye]

[Patrick Kelly]

Thanks Gordon!

Here lately I've been thinking that I need a horse for some strange reason....................................

[Gordon Frye]

Patrick;

Funny thing, for some reason, I think you need one too! Great minds think alike!

Here's me and my pal Henrik playing Normans at Hastings (for a History Channel gig last Summer, in fact)

Cheers!

Gordon

[Patrick Kelly]

Gordon,

When you say you were "playing Normans at Hastings" is that a general descriptor or were you actually playing Normans on-site at Hastings? If so I'm quite envious!

[Gordon Frye]

Patrick;

Sadly no, we weren't at Hastings, but rather in California (somehow the brown dry grass didn't quite match the green sward of Southern England...) However, my campaniero there, Henrik, DID go to Hastings a few years ago and rode with a conroi in the reenactment there. I'll send you something about it!

Cheers!

Gordon

[Ushio Kawana]

Hi

I found this illust...
http://www.bible-history.com/ibh/Weapons+and+...orse+Armor

[Ralph Grinly]

I'm pretty sure that no medieval warhorses ever wore any sort of armour ON their legs in battle situations Those rare armours that have something are probably late period "Parade-Only) sets. A horses lower legs are very thin skinned and boney. Chafe those legs, and you have a useless horse. Also, the horse needs to move the lower legs freely- today, you will get them wearing things like brushing boots, etc..but these are all made of fairly soft materials, not metal.
Horses DID wear loose/padded armour on their upper body, hanging down over upper legs, sometimes mail over this, very occasionally plate armour ..but not on the lower legs. Any illustrations that seem to show armour on the legs are pretty well all 'fantasy" victorian-era stuff..not based on reality

[Jakub Biblis]

[Ben Bouchard]

Personally I wouldn't be at all surprised to find that some form of fabric or leather was used just to protect a horse's legs from abrasion and impacts due bowling people over! Medicine boots/sports wraps are quite commonly used to provide extra support and protection during riding, and that's without any risk of knocking into people holding pointy things.



As others have mentioned, though, I think the chances of someone deliberately attacking a horse's legs to be comparatively minimal--I'd be more worried about accidental bumps and scrapes.

[Kurt Scholz]

I've heard that in China select sturdy troops with good armour and large daos could be used to strike at horses legs before the heavy cavalry impacted on the massed infantry.