Messer, Work in progress -- myArmoury.com

Ben Potter · Industry Professional

After many requests I have decided to craft a messer, and thought that you might like to watch this project as it goes along.
Also I would like your input. Please feel free to post. I will be updating the page on my site as I go along, and posting here when I do.

Here is a link to the: CRAFTING THE MESSER page.

I have a rough sketch done with the basic design.

Let me know what you think.

Enjoy!

M. Eversberg II · Posted: Wed 04 Nov, 2009 9:32 am Post subject:

Can we get an idea of proportions?

M.

Ken Speed · Posted: Wed 04 Nov, 2009 9:40 am Post subject:

Well, It looks like it will be a beautiful piece but my first reaction to the sketch is that either the hilt is too long for the blade or the blade is too short for the hilt.

Nathan Robinson · myArmoury Admin

Along with the comment about the proportions, my own preference would be to go towards something more historical in design. There is so much variety in what history has left us for grossemesser (and Germanic designs from that time period, in general). There's bound to be something that will attract you, let you express yourself, and allow you to create something unique in today's market.

Ben Potter · Industry Professional

This is the rough sketch, the proportions aren't accurate.

Also, I haven't settled on exactly what the hilt will be like yet so any historical pictures or information would be greatly appreciated. Let me know what you think.

Craig Shackleton · Posted: Wed 04 Nov, 2009 12:22 pm Post subject:

Just looking at the sketch without doing any measuring, the proportions look pretty similar to the messers in Leckuchner, at least to me.

I don't know anything about messer scabbards. I like the idea of an extra knife. Is that legit?

My one meaningful comment though is that the sketch shows a lug or wing or whatever that little projection from the crossguard is called. AFAIK, those were always only on the right hand side of the blade, and this one is on the left. I suppose it would make sense for a left-handed messer fighter, though.

I look forward to seeing the results. The world needs more messers.

Chad Arnow · myArmoury Team

Matthew Fedele · Posted: Wed 04 Nov, 2009 2:39 pm Post subject:

Ben Potter · Industry Professional

Thanks for all the input, I'll see if I can get a better sketch done in the next day or two.
(I am really with redoing my shop and installing new tooling)

Anders Backlund · Posted: Thu 05 Nov, 2009 8:16 am Post subject:

Yeah, I'd say the blade needs to be longer. That can't be more then, what, fifteen inches?

I'm of the opposite opinion as Nathan, though: the actual design is fine the way it is. If anything, I'd say its not ahistorical enough. Razz

The point of historical variety is valid, but keep in mind that unless you are specifically striving to make a historical sword, then historical references are still just suggestions at best.

Ben Potter · Industry Professional

I'll post an updated sketch later today (with the correct proportions 24" blade, 6" hilt) .

I did have a question, what exactly isn't historical about this design?

Nathan Robinson · myArmoury Admin

As Anders Backlund states, being historical isn't a requirement to making a sword. It's just my preference and my opinion that I offered. I'm also of the opinion that sword makers can learn quite a lot from making a few historical pieces before making their own designs, as knowledge of the past helps create functional and inspired unique designs. Either way, it's a good starting point from which to expand.

Ben Potter · Industry Professional

Nathan Robinson · myArmoury Admin

Please show me examples of the "blacksmith twist" (as I'm calling it for lack of a better term?) on extant original große messer. I just don't recall ever seeing it on one of these. Even contemporary writhen detailing (which I can't recall on these weapons) isn't a twist.

M. Eversberg II · Posted: Thu 05 Nov, 2009 4:49 pm Post subject:

Looks like it would be a very nifty piece.

M.

Ben Potter · Industry Professional

Nathan Robinson · myArmoury Admin

Either way, Ben, it's still an extremely attractive design. I don't want to steer you away from it. I just try to help people (to the best of my ability with my limited knowledge) know the context and whatnot. From there, the decisions are for each person to make individually, ya know?

I've really enjoyed the contemporary design elements mixed with historical inspiration that are in each of your pieces. I think you have an artistic eye, for sure.

Joel Chesser · Posted: Thu 05 Nov, 2009 5:52 pm Post subject:

For what it's worth I really like the design as is. I don't know if you are looking for more of a fantasy feel or not, but it seems to have it and I like it. It almost seems like something that one would see in a LOTR movie. It has a historical basis, with very complimentary elements. I'd really like to see this one made. Big Grin

Ben Potter · Industry Professional

Here is an alternative hilt design, I haven't decided wish I want to use.
Let me know what you think.

Nathan Robinson · myArmoury Admin

The cross-guard is nice, but the curved grip is odd. I can recall seeing a curved grip on one, but it was a long version with a very unusual blade and somewhat questionable authenticity.

I vote cross on #2 with straight grip and "pommel" of #1. The proportions of the cross-guard are a bit unusual in that they're usually more of a proportionally square section on historical samples. Your version will make for a nice and interesting departure.

You're a good artist. Your sketches are always well done.

Check this out, by the way. You might like it. The blade is complex.

A Grosse Messer, circa 1500
Appearing in a Christie's auction catalog, October 1994.