| If it was possible to make a sword out of authentic bloomery iron, for the same price as one made of modern spring steel, would you buy it? |
| Yes |
|
60% |
[ 57 ] |
| No |
|
13% |
[ 13 ] |
| Maybe I'd buy one |
|
25% |
[ 24 ] |
|
| Total Votes : 94 |
|
| Author |
Message |
Ken Jay
Location: Portland Oregon Joined: 23 Aug 2003
Posts: 141
|
 Posted: Thu 08 Oct, 2009 1:35 pm Post subject: |
 |
|
|
I don't think I would. While I appreciate a good recreation, I don't collect swords just as decoration. I actually use them to cut stuff and consider them weapons. A practical modern steel/heat treated performance blade is more important to me than absolute historical accuracy.
|
|
  |
 |
|
C Bosh
Location: France Joined: 10 Aug 2009
Posts: 15
|
| Posted: Thu 08 Oct, 2009 11:17 pm Post subject: |
|
|
I am lucky in that I own 2 swords made from traditional smelting and forging. Are they as good as new swords? I do not care, they are the swords I love and study. The feel is fantastic and if it is only in my head, thats ok with me.
Would a modern steel be chosen if available back in time . proberble - or more probable , better weapons that could be made with the better science , fire arms etc.
The point is they are as close as possible as I can get to the originals in pristine condition, and my connection with the past.
I think of the people who have replica old cars, modern engines and breaks, would they swop for a real oil leaking original ? most would !
Just my feeling, modern swords are , if better in some ways not the same.
Main problem is of cause the cost. Sorry for my English
|
|
|
|
|
Paul Hansen
|
| Posted: Fri 09 Oct, 2009 6:33 am Post subject: |
|
|
For me personally, the answer is yes. What I regularly do with my swords (dry handling and some occasional test cutting) does not warrant "the best possible steel" anyway. I collect swords because they connect me to a past world. I do have some bronze swords, most of them made by Neil Burridge, but also some by Jeroen Zuiderwijk, and while they probably lack some trace elements, they are metallurgically more or less identical to the originals. I would love to get a steel sword from authentic materials when I can afford it.
| Joe Fults wrote: | | What the initial hypothetical fails to address is the quality of the finished bloomery blade. In fact it tends to imply a merely "servicable" blade from bloomery iron. At the end of the day I'm not sure I'm willing to pay for that novelty if there is a significant quality gap in the final products. If the end result of ALL things are equal, sure, why not. However, this hypothetical does not seem to imply equal outcomes which can alter the equation in my eyes. |
This is the generalisation I meant in my initial post. It seems that "most" (or at least a significant number) of original medieval swords have some pretty serious defects, such as inclusions, large variance in hardness and/or chemical composition etc. See for instance this article: http://www.myArmoury.com/feature_bladehardness.html
In a modern made swords, such defects would not be acceptable. You probably remember the discussion after for instance the failure of some Hanwei Godfred blades. Not to compare that specific failure to what might happen with a sword made of authentic materials, but you get the idea.
With the knowledge we now have, it could theoretically be possible to recreate the original Ulfbehrt blades. Cost for research included, these would obviously cost more than a sword made of some more generic bloomery iron, which might be more or less identical to a steel which was used in some medieval sword of "average" quality.
My question is whether the modern experienced user/collector would be willing to "put up" with some defects, if the result was something inherently more authentic.
| Dan Howard wrote: | | Personally it would depend on what I wanted the sword for. |
What I had in mind was what I guess most people do with their higher end reproductions: collection, decoration, dry handling and perhaps some light test cutting. But perhaps most importantly (for me at least) as a connection to a past they feel attracted to. In this respect, I do expect a sword to be fit for it's original intended function, although I would obviously never use it as such.
It makes sense that for activities where you depend on quality material, like fencing, one would want the best possible, without much regard for historical authenticity. For experimental archeology, one of course needs the closest reproduction one can get, without much regard for other factors. But I assumed that most people would not regularly fence or do experimental archeology with a higher end reproduction, although I realise that some do.
| Jean Thibodeau wrote: | 1) The " ART OBJECT " using period steel.
3) For a high end collectable but wanting the best sword one could make then using modern steel of similar carbon content but being modern steel much more homogeneous and free of inclusions. |
What is the diffence between these two, in your opinion? As I said above, most higher end reproductions probably aren't used so often, so why "want the best sword one could make"?
|
|
|
|
|
Dan Howard
|
| Posted: Fri 09 Oct, 2009 2:14 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Paul Hansen wrote: | | What I had in mind was what I guess most people do with their higher end reproductions: collection, decoration, dry handling and perhaps some light test cutting. But perhaps most importantly (for me at least) as a connection to a past they feel attracted to. In this respect, I do expect a sword to be fit for it's original intended function, although I would obviously never use it as such. |
In this case I would pick an existing museum example and ask for a replica made as closely as possible to the original. This would involve bloomery iron and traditional forging techniques. The cost wouldn't be an issue to me so long as it was a very good replica.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Joe Fults
|
| Posted: Fri 09 Oct, 2009 3:47 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Paul Hansen wrote: | | My question is whether the modern experienced user/collector would be willing to "put up" with some defects, if the result was something inherently more authentic. |
Its really going to depend on what the defects are. I already have some pieces in my collection with imperfections that I tolerate just fine because they are hand forged and the imperfections are artifacts of that process. Its worth noting that imperfections do not have to appear on hand forged blades. I've seen some hand forged blades that are perfect or ridiculously close to it. That said, there are limits to what I would find acceptable and authenticity is in the eye of the beholder.
"The goal shouldn’t be to avoid being evil; it should be to actively do good." - Danah Boyd
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
You cannot attach files in this forum
You can download files in this forum
|
All contents © Copyright 2003-2024 myArmoury.com — All rights reserved
Discussion forums powered by phpBB © The phpBB Group
Switch to the Basic Low-bandwidth Version of the forum
|
This is a standard topic
