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M. Eversberg II

Location: California, Maryland, USA
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PostPosted: Sat 23 Dec, 2006 9:00 pm    Post subject: A Lady's Favour...         Reply with quote

Tell me about them. What time period where they the thing to have? What where they really? When did you get them?

I'm under the impression they are a 13th-16th century tournament item, normally a handkerchief or part of a wimple given to a knight that looks the most attractive during a jousting meet.

I dislike my misconceptions and this is another one that needs to be adjusted!

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Jared Smith

Location: Tennessee
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PostPosted: Sun 24 Dec, 2006 8:40 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Beginnings of the emphasis on obtaining approval of courtly ladies existed during the 12th century. I have been researching that era hat from a tournament perspective, but was not cataloging the romantic aspect of it. Some of the things I have come across and remember are below.

Ladies and courtly love were a significant aspect of chivalry and the status of upwardly mobile knights during the 12th century. It was considered something of a requirment to have participated on the winning side of the melee tournaments in order for the ladies at court to consider a lowly knight worthy of their attention (per the writtings of about 1130.) Ladies of nobility would sometimes present the prize to the tournament grand champion. Part of the status and tradition that is very clearly a dominant aspect of provencial French poetry and knightly character was the topic of courtly love. Knights were expected to be versatile enough to have some form of art (poetry, singing, writing, courtly manners, etc.) if they were to be accepted into close association with the courts and nobility. Marriage to the daughter of a noble did occur at that time and was a good opportunity for non noble knights to ascend to a better life standard.

In the 13th century (1220's), some knights such as Ulrich Von Lichtenstein consistently claimed to perform their tournament feats and early Pas d' Arms (joust challenges) in the name of a lady. Ulrich claimed that he wore a heavy chain around his neck throughout one year of this Pas d'Arms style of errant challenge, and that it was penetance until he could re-earn her (different ladies in different years) favor as a result of some act which caused him to fall out of favor with the lady. I can't read his autobiography in native German, but occasionally come across a German translation of his feats that says he went so far as to cut off one of his fingers and present it to his intended love at a tournament when asked how she could know that his love was sincere. Regardless of the truth of this, it illustrates the kinds of notions that persisted by early 13th century.

Absence of evidence is not necessarily evidence of absence!
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Richard Fay

Location: Upstate New York
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PostPosted: Sun 24 Dec, 2006 8:45 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Happy Holidays all!

I seem to recall that a lady's sleeve could also sometimes be used as a favour, especially in the cases of removable sleeves. It is suggested that the heraldic charge called a maunch was inspired by a lady's sleeve. I think your dates are fairly close; I will have to do some research to find out the specifics. Not today, though, it's Christmas Eve, and I've got holiday stuff to do!

Stay safe!

"I'm going to do what the warriors of old did! I'm going to recite poetry!"
Prince Andrew of Armar
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