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Justin Pasternak




Location: West Springfield, Massachusetts
Joined: 17 Sep 2006

Posts: 174

PostPosted: Tue 12 Dec, 2006 7:58 am    Post subject: Horse Stirrups         Reply with quote

Were stirrups used before the 4th century A.D. And what are the major differences between short and long stirrups when using a particular weapon in battle such as a lance, mace, sword or a bow?
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Shamsi Modarai




Location: On wuda bearwe, under actreo in žam eoršscręfe.
Joined: 25 Nov 2006
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PostPosted: Tue 12 Dec, 2006 8:44 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Aww.....crap! I just had a huge long explanation typed out, and then the server ate it. Sad

I suppose for now, I'll just link you to Wikipedia, which has some decent info on the subject:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stirrups



Sorry about that. Blush

Wa biš žam že sceal of langože leofes abidan.

~ The Wife's Lament
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Lafayette C Curtis




Location: Indonesia
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PostPosted: Tue 12 Dec, 2006 9:47 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

I don't know what the difference would be in the use of swords because I've never tried to "stand in the stirrups" while striking a blow--I always end up wobbling and missing the strike when I do that, so I prefer to sit firmly in the saddle regardless of stirrup length when there's a sword in my hand. But with the bow, using short stirrups and rising a little in them certainly helps with clearance, especially when I'm using a symmetrical bow and drawing all the way to the end of my imaginary moustache. Imaginary, that is, because I shave quite often but I still know where it ends. I actually press the anchor against one of my teeth.

That's just my personal experience, though. Other people's are guaranteed to differ. And actually I prefer short stirrups even with the sword because I'm simply more used to it.
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Shamsi Modarai




Location: On wuda bearwe, under actreo in žam eoršscręfe.
Joined: 25 Nov 2006
Reading list: 16 books

Posts: 110

PostPosted: Tue 12 Dec, 2006 9:54 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

There were supposedly "toe stirrups" used in northern India (2nd c. BC? ) and then later a single mounting stirrup was used to make mounting while fully armed easier. Then came the paired stirrups, the first recorded stirrups, in China in 4th c. AD....and these had migrated over to most of Europe by 8th c. AD.

Knights/calvary, using swords and lances, rode with long stirrups (aka modern day dressage), which kept them from being thrown from the saddle......Mounted archers (such as eastern european and steppe cultures, etc) rode with short stirrups so they could stand up to gain a higher shooting position.

That basically sums up the article I wrote that got lost. Razz

Wa biš žam že sceal of langože leofes abidan.

~ The Wife's Lament


Last edited by Shamsi Modarai on Tue 12 Dec, 2006 12:15 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Hugh Fuller




Location: Virginia
Joined: 01 Oct 2003

Posts: 256

PostPosted: Tue 12 Dec, 2006 12:01 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

I have read somewhare of Scythian/Sarmatian graves in the Ukraine that date from the 2nd Century BCE or so with what appear to be wooden stirrups in them. These may well be something else mistaken for stirrups, I don't know, but it sure sounded interesting. I remember that Gillian Bradshaw has an author's note at the end of her novel Island of Ghosts: A Novel of Roman Britain about why she chose to have the Sarmatians sent to Britain by Marcus Aurelius around 170CE using stirrups. She refers to these discoveries and cites articles about them.
Hugh
Still trying to walk in the Light
Please see 1 John 1:5
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Shamsi Modarai




Location: On wuda bearwe, under actreo in žam eoršscręfe.
Joined: 25 Nov 2006
Reading list: 16 books

Posts: 110

PostPosted: Tue 12 Dec, 2006 12:41 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

That does sound familiar.....though honestly I have done no real research on this subject so I really wouldn't know what is most current in terms of archeological finds. I have a hard enough time keeping up with new research in my subject of study! Eek!
Wa biš žam že sceal of langože leofes abidan.

~ The Wife's Lament
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Jean Thibodeau




Location: Montreal,Quebec,Canada
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PostPosted: Tue 12 Dec, 2006 1:06 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Shamsi Modarai wrote:
Aww.....crap! I just had a huge long explanation typed out, and then the server ate it. Sad

I suppose for now, I'll just link you to Wikipedia, which has some decent info on the subject:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stirrups



Sorry about that. Blush


I hate when that happens. Evil Have you tried just clicking on the back arrow what shows the previous page ?

If it's just during the " submit process " that you lose the text you might be able to recover it if you don't exit the program or do too many other things before trying. Works for me 99% of the time.

By the way, welcome to the site although you have been here for a while anyway: I enjoy your posts and you seem to have a wicked sense of humour. ( Double meaning here or pun ! ) Cool

You can easily give up your freedom. You have to fight hard to get it back!
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Hugh Fuller




Location: Virginia
Joined: 01 Oct 2003

Posts: 256

PostPosted: Wed 13 Dec, 2006 7:39 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

I would also observe that those who believe that stirrups are needed for an active cavalry really do need to look into the Romano-Celtic saddle as reconstructed by Peter Connolly. I have seen pics and films of re-enactor cavalry using it doing all kinds of things that were previously thought impssible w/o stirrups. For more on this, I suggest Ann Hyland's excellent works, Medieval Warhorse & Training the Roman Cavalry: From Arrian's Ars Tactica. These are both out of print, but they are available.
Hugh
Still trying to walk in the Light
Please see 1 John 1:5
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