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Martin Wallgren




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PostPosted: Tue 23 May, 2006 6:09 am    Post subject: Searching films depicting 15:th C.         Reply with quote

Which film do you guys think depicts the 15:th C. the best. Whant to buy it for a friend for his birthday to make him interessted in joining my quest in life, namly recreating the fightingstyles of thet period. But I thought I should ease him in on it...
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Roger Hooper




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PostPosted: Tue 23 May, 2006 6:46 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Kenneth Branagh's version of Shakespeare's Henry V

How many films have been set in the XVth century? I can't think of any others offhand.
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Blaz Berlec




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PostPosted: Tue 23 May, 2006 6:49 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

One candidate could be:

Tke Advocate (a.k.a The Hour of the Pig).



(Ignore the silly cover, or the silly coments on it.)

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00008L3S0/q...&n=130

But unfortunately it does not show any military stuff, let alone fighting styles. For that kind of thing I would strongly recommend this DVD:


The Longsword of Johannes Liechtenauer, Part I

http://www.chivalrybookshelf.com/titles/DVDs/...ochs1.html



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Extant 15th century Milanese armour
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Geoff Wood




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PostPosted: Tue 23 May, 2006 8:21 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

I like The Seventh Seal, but i assume from the subject matter that that is 14th rather then 15th century. Maybe 'Chimes at Midnight'. Shakespeare by Orson Welles, but IIRC there is a rather gritty (for the time) battle sequence in it.
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Roger Hooper




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PostPosted: Tue 23 May, 2006 10:49 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

There is a whole stack of Joan of Arc movies made in the last 75 years. The latest - "The Messenger" with Milla Jovovich and "Joan of Arc" with Leelee Sobieski. Are their combat scenes authentic? Not likely.
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Joachim Nilsson





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PostPosted: Tue 23 May, 2006 11:52 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Martin, I wouldn't touch Branagh's Henry V with a ten foot pole if I were you. Unless you like seeing KNITTED maille, halberds belonging to the late 16th/early 17th Century and similar debacled crap like that...
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Chad Arnow
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PostPosted: Tue 23 May, 2006 12:12 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Joachim Nilsson wrote:
Martin, I wouldn't touch Branagh's Henry V with a ten foot pole if I were you. Unless you like seeing KNITTED maille, halberds belonging to the late 16th/early 17th Century and similar debacled crap like that...


In terms of acting and filmscore, it's quite well done. In terms of tactics, combat, and arms and armour, it's way off. If you like well-acted Shakespeare, though, this is a great film.

Happy

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Joachim Nilsson





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PostPosted: Tue 23 May, 2006 12:15 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Chad Arnow wrote:
Joachim Nilsson wrote:
Martin, I wouldn't touch Branagh's Henry V with a ten foot pole if I were you. Unless you like seeing KNITTED maille, halberds belonging to the late 16th/early 17th Century and similar debacled crap like that...


In terms of acting and filmscore, it's quite well done. In terms of tactics, combat, and arms and armour, it's way off. If you like well-acted Shakespeare, though, this is a great film.


Which thus makes it utterly unsuitable for Martin's intended goal.
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Chad Arnow
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PostPosted: Tue 23 May, 2006 12:23 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Joachim Nilsson wrote:
Which thus makes it utterly unsuitable for Martin's intended goal.


Probably true is some ways. Of course, as we all know, movies with a high degree of accuracy are hard to find. If your sole criteria is accuracy, then you'll almost always be disappointed.

Of course, watching a good movie (accurate or not) can ignite someone's excitement. In some ways, inaccuracies can be better conversation starters than a movie that gives you plenty of accuracy but little else to talk about.

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Joachim Nilsson





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PostPosted: Tue 23 May, 2006 12:25 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Chad Arnow wrote:


Of course, as we all know, movies with a high degree of accuracy are hard to find. If your sole criteria is accuracy, then you'll almost always be disappointed.



Which is way I'm trying to steer Martin away from that particular movie. Knowing him personally I know that he'll most likely come away from it with pretty severe feeling of disappointment and, in fact, annoyance.
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Roger Hooper




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PostPosted: Tue 23 May, 2006 12:40 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Joachim, what then is the movie set during the 15th century that depicts arms and battle accurately?
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Martin Wallgren




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PostPosted: Tue 23 May, 2006 12:53 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Woah!

I know Exactly what JN try to say to me! Thanx Broh! I dont wanna se it!

No, as JN know, what I am after is a film that depicts clothes and arms and armour that is on the more accurate side. I am painfully aware I won´t get anything with close to good fightingscenes (from Jn:s and my point of view).

But thanx anyway all, hope this claryfied!

M

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Chad Arnow
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PostPosted: Tue 23 May, 2006 12:55 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Martin Wallgren wrote:
No, as JN know, what I am after is a film that depicts clothes and arms and armour that is on the more accurate side. I am painfully aware I won´t get anything with close to good fightingscenes (from Jn:s and my point of view).

But thanx anyway all, hope this claryfied!

M


It does clarify it. In that case: Good luck finding something that meets that criteria. I doubt there's much out there.

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Joachim Nilsson





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PostPosted: Tue 23 May, 2006 1:46 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

I so totally fail to see the problem with me wanting to steer my friend away from what both he and I considering to be a movie that will not meet his expectations by a longshot. Furthermore: Just because I scorn one film; it doesn't necessarily and automatically entail that I'll recommend anything better set in the 15th Century. Because that is the crux of the matter: There simply are no movies set in that time-period out there that will meet my friend's criteria. They simply haven't been done.

Martin, what you have to do is to use all the available media out there as a smorgasbord of film; you have to pick out small components from a variety of films. And none of them are set directly in your desired century. Sad but true. You can, if you will, compare it to films that try to convey the German Wehrmacht in a realistic manner. Those are very few and very far apart. I can think of two at the moment. And -returning to the subject at hand- you already know my opinion on, for instance, Luc Besson's ventures in the 15th Century so I wont rehash them here.

And, lastly, for the record: Neither Martin nor I are so blantanly naive that we walk around expecting to find the perfect 15th century film that fulfills our wishes when it comes to arms and armour etc. I find that implication insulting. We know full well of the amount of celluloid nonsence and fecal matter that is rampant in the "glorious" world of cinema. Martin was probably just hoping for some, hitherto to him unknown little nugget of gold.
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PostPosted: Tue 23 May, 2006 2:08 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

The confrontational tone in this topic is unwelcome.
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Geoff Wood




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PostPosted: Tue 23 May, 2006 2:12 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Well, insult's to the questioner and colleague's intelligence were not intended. Pity that well meant responses were taken that way, but, ho hum, that's the sort of misunderstanding that web fora seem to make more easy.

Edit, posted before I read previous comment. I'll remove this post if you wish.
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Chuck Russell




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PostPosted: Tue 23 May, 2006 2:41 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Hour of the Pig is the Uk's version of the Advocate. as far as clothing and accessories this movie is as close as one could hope for in a 15thc movie.
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Blaz Berlec




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PostPosted: Tue 23 May, 2006 3:30 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

And the plot of the movie also helps in the "authenticity" area! Big Grin

But the reviewers really have a hard time to place it in a certain genre. I've seen it labeled as historical movie, drama, comedy, satire, murder mystery, courtroom thriller ... And the truth is - they're all right.


Extant 15th Century German Gothic Armour
Extant 15th century Milanese armour
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Chuck Russell




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PostPosted: Tue 23 May, 2006 3:59 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Blaz Berlec wrote:
And the plot of the movie also helps in the "authenticity" area! Big Grin

But the reviewers really have a hard time to place it in a certain genre. I've seen it labeled as historical movie, drama, comedy, satire, murder mystery, courtroom thriller ... And the truth is - they're all right.


and lots of nudity Wink especially in the hour of the pig version

my 15thc group watched this movie together. we laughed and watched then were like WAIT rewind that.... look, inside his doublet a teh seam they got it right. and looking at the table settings and such. mostly the guy stuff they got right save that silly tie on sleeved garment. the womans clothes i think were all off though
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Jean Thibodeau




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PostPosted: Tue 23 May, 2006 4:02 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Here are some very old period films that might be interesting;

Probably 13th Century but entertaining, I have no idea about availability in DVD:

THE BLACK ROSE 1950 http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0042256/

Saxon lord escapes England taking with him an archer and they travel to the court of Kubla Khan. Sort of an English Marco Polo.

Oh, here one of the best period picts I remember seeing:

PRINCE OF FOXES 1949 With Orson Welles as Cesare Borgia http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0041767/

Set in 1500 A.D. Read the link for details but I remember at least one very good siege and all the cut-troat Renaissance politics one could wish for.

I'm going to see if I can find this movie at my local DVD place: Saw this movie last 30years ago and it' s still stuck in my memory as very good. Today, if I see it again, I should be either very impressed or disappointed. Eek!

Well early 16th Century by one year, should be close enough to late 15th to be worth seeing.

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