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Howard Waddell
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PostPosted: Wed 31 Aug, 2005 3:19 pm    Post subject: Preview of New Waxes...         Reply with quote

The Thegn, The Bayeux, The Hospitaller and the Reeve waxes arrived today from Peter in Sweden.



Had to show you the Thegn...

See more here:

http://www.albion-swords.com/albion-sword-news.htm

Best,

Howy

Albion Swords Ltd
http://albion-swords.com
http://filmswords.com
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Thomas Jason




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PostPosted: Wed 31 Aug, 2005 3:32 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Howy:

The Thegn looks Amazing!

Also, any info on the Steel Classics Show?

I'm going with some friends that weekend to LV, they aren't sword folks, but I'd like to try and convince them to attend it with me.
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Howard Waddell
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PostPosted: Wed 31 Aug, 2005 3:42 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Thomas Jason wrote:
Howy:

The Thegn looks Amazing!

Also, any info on the Steel Classics Show?

I'm going with some friends that weekend to LV, they aren't sword folks, but I'd like to try and convince them to attend it with me.


Don't know what booth we'll have yet or what swords we'll have to show, but here is the general info:

Steel Classics Show
October 28th, 29th, 30th
Mandalay Bay Resort & Casino
Las Vegas, Nevada

Best,

Howy

Albion Swords Ltd
http://albion-swords.com
http://filmswords.com
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Jay Barron




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PostPosted: Wed 31 Aug, 2005 5:41 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

The Thegn is one of the swords I've been waiting for. Is it a two piece riveted pommel?
Constant and true.
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Peter Johnsson
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PostPosted: Thu 01 Sep, 2005 12:03 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Jay Barron wrote:
The Thegn is one of the swords I've been waiting for. Is it a two piece riveted pommel?


It is a one piece.
In this one I wanted to explore a possibility to make a one piece casting and still get as close as possible to real twisted wire.
I think it will take close examination to be able to tell the difference in the finished piece.

On originals of this type you generally do not see any rivets securing top and bottom together. They were possibly (probably?) made in a two piece construction, but in a way they look like solid one piece contructions: no visible binding/riveting other than the tang going through all the way. It is actually hard to tell how they were put together when you look at originals.

This construction will affect the price in a positive way, minimize hazzle in mounting, and in the end will look just like a well put together two part construction. (it will also make Eric McHugh a much happier man...:-)

The two part costruction is very popular in theory, but in reality the price becomes a bit prohibitive.
I think this solution will bring the best of two worlds, so to say: authentic shapes and volumes, well defined twisted wire and attractive price.
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Brian M




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PostPosted: Thu 01 Sep, 2005 12:44 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Come to Daddy, Bayeaux!
So Howy, very roughly, what are we looking at for the Bayeaux? Late November?

Brian M
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Kenneth Enroth




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PostPosted: Thu 01 Sep, 2005 4:09 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Are we going to see any of the new gladii soon?
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Patrick Kelly




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PostPosted: Thu 01 Sep, 2005 4:54 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

The Thegn looks like an interesting design, much more so than I thought it would be. Loving that Reeve!
"In valor there is hope.".................. Tacitus
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Howard Waddell
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PostPosted: Thu 01 Sep, 2005 6:46 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Kenneth Enroth wrote:
Are we going to see any of the new gladii soon?


Hey Ken!

The bronze parts are done, the grips are finalized, the blades are ground and ready... we are just waiting for the guards and pommels to be finished. I was hoping we'd have at least one out in August, but it should be sometime this month.

Best,

Howy

Albion Swords Ltd
http://albion-swords.com
http://filmswords.com
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Howard Waddell
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PostPosted: Thu 01 Sep, 2005 6:48 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Brian M wrote:
Come to Daddy, Bayeaux!
So Howy, very roughly, what are we looking at for the Bayeaux? Late November?

Brian M


Hey Brian!

It all depends on how quickly (but exactly) we can get the molding done. Late November is probably a good target.

Thanks!

Howy

Albion Swords Ltd
http://albion-swords.com
http://filmswords.com
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Thomas Jason




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PostPosted: Thu 01 Sep, 2005 7:22 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Peter Johnsson wrote:
Jay Barron wrote:
The Thegn is one of the swords I've been waiting for. Is it a two piece riveted pommel?

This construction will affect the price in a positive way, minimize hazzle in mounting, and in the end will look just like a well put together two part construction. (it will also make Eric McHugh a much happier man...:-)


So the price will be going down on it?
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Randolph Howard




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PostPosted: Thu 01 Sep, 2005 7:41 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Howard Waddell wrote:
Kenneth Enroth wrote:
Are we going to see any of the new gladii soon?


Hey Ken!

The bronze parts are done, the grips are finalized, the blades are ground and ready... we are just waiting for the guards and pommels to be finished. I was hoping we'd have at least one out in August, but it should be sometime this month.




Hooray!! I'm gagging for the Mainz. Hurry and end my suffering! Big Grin

Hmm- still havn't quite mastered quoting...

"A collision at sea can ruin your entire day."
-Thucydides.
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Michael Sigman
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PostPosted: Thu 01 Sep, 2005 8:27 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Thomas Jason wrote:
Peter Johnsson wrote:
Jay Barron wrote:
The Thegn is one of the swords I've been waiting for. Is it a two piece riveted pommel?

This construction will affect the price in a positive way, minimize hazzle in mounting, and in the end will look just like a well put together two part construction. (it will also make Eric McHugh a much happier man...:-)


So the price will be going down on it?


The price will not go down on it. It is $200 less then the 2 piece pommels. That was what Peter was referring too. Sorry to get you worked up Thomas. Razz

Mike Sigman
Albion Swords
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Thomas Jason




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PostPosted: Thu 01 Sep, 2005 9:09 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Michael Sigman wrote:
Thomas Jason wrote:
Peter Johnsson wrote:
Jay Barron wrote:
The Thegn is one of the swords I've been waiting for. Is it a two piece riveted pommel?

This construction will affect the price in a positive way, minimize hazzle in mounting, and in the end will look just like a well put together two part construction. (it will also make Eric McHugh a much happier man...:-)


So the price will be going down on it?


The price will not go down on it. It is $200 less then the 2 piece pommels. That was what Peter was referring too. Sorry to get you worked up Thomas. Razz


Boo! Hiss!
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Joe Fults




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PostPosted: Thu 01 Sep, 2005 10:07 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Howard Waddell wrote:
Kenneth Enroth wrote:
Are we going to see any of the new gladii soon?


Hey Ken!

The bronze parts are done, the grips are finalized, the blades are ground and ready... we are just waiting for the guards and pommels to be finished. I was hoping we'd have at least one out in August, but it should be sometime this month.

Best,

Howy


I look forward to seeing them, even though tution has me tapped out.

"Our life is what our thoughts make it"
-Marcus Aurelius

"Those who make peaceful revolution impossible will make violent revolution inevitable."
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Robert B. Allison




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PostPosted: Thu 01 Sep, 2005 10:18 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

So the price will be going down on it?[/quote]


I'm recalling that the Next Gen sale goes for another two or three weeks, and believe that it also applies to swords not yet in production, in the pipeline so to speak, so you could order the Thegn now and save a C-note.
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Thomas Jason




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PostPosted: Thu 01 Sep, 2005 10:33 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

I've had it on order quite a while.

I had to admit that when I ordered it I expected the two-piece pommel.

I really like this blade, but now it kind of feels like the wind was let out of my sails a little.
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Kenneth Enroth




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PostPosted: Thu 01 Sep, 2005 11:35 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Thomas Jason wrote:
I've had it on order quite a while.

I had to admit that when I ordered it I expected the two-piece pommel.

I really like this blade, but now it kind of feels like the wind was let out of my sails a little.


Guess there is too little demand for the expensive two-piece pommels. You all need to buy the expensive models, not the cheap ones.
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Geoff Wood




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PostPosted: Thu 01 Sep, 2005 12:32 pm    Post subject: pommel profile         Reply with quote

Peter Johnsson wrote:
On originals of this type you generally do not see any rivets securing top and bottom together. They were possibly (probably?) made in a two piece construction, but in a way they look like solid one piece contructions: no visible binding/riveting other than the tang going through all the way. It is actually hard to tell how they were put together when you look at originals.


Peter
From the small number of examples that I've seen pictures of I'd completely agree that if they are two piece, it does not seem to be done with rivets. As I say, the number of examples I've seen depicted is small, so my ignorance probably explains the next point, but I'll ask anyway. The profile of the pommel appears very simple. In the Gilling, or the British Museum 1912 7-23 1, or the Musee de l'Armee JPO 2262 or the Wensley there appear to be at least two very distinct secondary lobes either side of the central lobe. The same is shown on the Scandinavian historical example on the Thegn part of the Albion website. In the wax as shown, this secondary lobe effect is almost lost, with only the residual thickness of the edge of the 'saddles' remaining. Are the examples on which this is based available other than by the extensive travelling and research that you've obviously had to carry out, and if yes, could you point me in the right direction?
thanks
Geoff Wood
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Peter Johnsson
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PostPosted: Thu 01 Sep, 2005 2:01 pm    Post subject: Re: pommel profile         Reply with quote

Geoff Wood wrote:
Peter
From the small number of examples that I've seen pictures of I'd completely agree that if they are two piece, it does not seem to be done with rivets. As I say, the number of examples I've seen depicted is small, so my ignorance probably explains the next point, but I'll ask anyway. The profile of the pommel appears very simple. In the Gilling, or the British Museum 1912 7-23 1, or the Musee de l'Armee JPO 2262 or the Wensley there appear to be at least two very distinct secondary lobes either side of the central lobe. The same is shown on the Scandinavian historical example on the Thegn part of the Albion website. In the wax as shown, this secondary lobe effect is almost lost, with only the residual thickness of the edge of the 'saddles' remaining. Are the examples on which this is based available other than by the extensive travelling and research that you've obviously had to carry out, and if yes, could you point me in the right direction?
thanks
Geoff Wood


There are many examples of precisely this shape. It is pretty common, IŽd say.
I think there is a whole family of hilts that are more plain, usually perserved in plain iron, that has more stylized beast heads that are of this kidney or saddle shape.

What you interpret as secondary lobes are probably the top of the "saddle shapes" I think.
These can be shaped a bit differently: sometimes small and close to the sweep of the peak, other times more independent with more pointed "ears". These can become so large as to look like separate lobes.
The one Eric and I documented in Uppsala is also of the same type, only the beast heads, or saddle shapes are removed further from the mid peak and therefore might give an impression of another pair of lobes.

In some cases Anglo saxon hilts *do* have more lobes or more elaborated beast heads (the saddle shapes are stylized beast heads) with ears, eyes and snouts fully sculpted. Usually these are more elaborate and decorated. They can be silvered, cast in bronze or silver or decorated with inlays of semi-precious stones. I cannot rember seeing any clear examples of five lobed pommles of this type (beast heads on each side of prominent peak) in plain iron...

I attatch one example of a sword found on Gotland, kept in the store room of the Historical Museum of Visby (Could it have belonged to an Englishman caught in bad weather far away from home, or was it a souvenir brought home from a successful business trip to England?). It is of the very type and shape that inspired the "Thegn". There are more examples, but perhaps this is enough to serve an an example?
Note that even though Father Time has had his fun with this sword, you can still not really tell that the pommel is made in two peices: no rivets securing upper and lower together (they are held in place by the tang going through, if indeed they are separate). In this situation, making a pommel like this in two parts for the "Thegn" will only serve to increase price to the level of the other two part vikings without adding anything to the looks, handling, feel or character of the sword. (Unless we are talking about a unique one off custom-made sword, but that is another situation all together).



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