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Aaron Schnatterly




Location: New Glarus, WI
Joined: 16 Feb 2005
Reading list: 67 books

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PostPosted: Mon 01 Aug, 2005 1:17 pm    Post subject: Worthwhile addition I hope I never need to use         Reply with quote

As many of you are aware, my collection has grown... significantly. I'm not alone. A lot of you have sizeable and valuable collections as well. It's unthinkable, and would be unbearable, but how many of us have looked at what would happen if...?

I did.

I checked into what it would take to insure the collection. I found out some very interesting information. Homeowners or rental insurance won't do. Coverage is limited, and claims questionable.

The answer was collectable insurance. There are a number of brokers offering this - just be certain that your collection(s) will be covered. The few calls I made helped me sort through these issues. A couple only dealt with firearms or cars. In my case, I had to write 2 separate policies - one for edged weapons, the other for armour, antique books, and clothing. I was able to get both policies (paid in full for a year) for under $100 total.

As the thread title says, I hope I never need it, but it's well worth the cost. I figured that it might be something some of you may not have thought of or considered seriously...

-Aaron Schnatterly
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Russ Ellis
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Joined: 20 Aug 2003
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PostPosted: Mon 01 Aug, 2005 1:20 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Oh now that's very interesting... Never thought to look into that and it sounds cheaper then an expensive safe...
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Harlan Hastings
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Location: Finger Lakes, NY
Joined: 19 Sep 2003

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PostPosted: Mon 01 Aug, 2005 1:24 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Excellent advice and info Aaron! I have one or two pieces I should have insured myself. Razz
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Aaron Schnatterly




Location: New Glarus, WI
Joined: 16 Feb 2005
Reading list: 67 books

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Posts: 1,244

PostPosted: Mon 01 Aug, 2005 1:32 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Russ Ellis wrote:
Oh now that's very interesting... Never thought to look into that and it sounds cheaper then an expensive safe...


Not that it's the same thing, not at all. In the case of the agency I went with, a safe, home alarm system, etc. didn't matter under something like $25k in coverage. If it's a question of one or the other, the insurance is a lot cheaper, and covers, safe or not. A safe also only covers your butt if your pieces are in it, and only if it isn't damaged, stolen, or something. Bad fire that still destroys it's contents, and, well... still lost.

A good gun safe that could hold my collection is likely between $500 and $1000.

There's more to it than just covering stuff in the home. If I am traveling, pieces are covered (with some restrictions, like proper packaging) and I can cover things against loss while being shipped via carriers (USPS, UPS, FedEx, etc.) with different limits and restrictions. Also, something that may be of particular interest to you, Russ, is that I can get an amount of coverage for what I expect to have in the house - including something like the $5k in RT swords Albion sent, or that smallsword you have posted pics of. It doesn't have to be yours, just have the amount of coverage to cover your six.

-Aaron Schnatterly
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Russ Ellis
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PostPosted: Mon 01 Aug, 2005 1:59 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

That's outstanding news Aaron! Thanks so much for posting your findings!
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Joe Fults




Location: Midwest
Joined: 02 Sep 2003

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PostPosted: Mon 01 Aug, 2005 2:10 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

I'm actually more worried about liabilty for cutting parties and such than I am about theft. Then again I only have two swords. Different scale altogether, although I have a polearm, dagger, and another sword that may arrive in the next 6-9 months.
"Our life is what our thoughts make it"
-Marcus Aurelius

"Those who make peaceful revolution impossible will make violent revolution inevitable."
-John F. Kennedy
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Aaron Schnatterly




Location: New Glarus, WI
Joined: 16 Feb 2005
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Posts: 1,244

PostPosted: Mon 01 Aug, 2005 2:15 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Joe Fults wrote:
I'm acually more worried aobut liabilty for cutting parties and such than I am about theft. Then again I only have two sword and one on order. Different scale altogether.


This is a completely separate issue, no doubt. Go with a signed waiver of liability if it's a significant concern, and practice as safe an arena as you can. Safety rules go without saying, I know... but we did have a few accidents discussed on the forum recently - a good thing if we all take the time to learn from them.

-Aaron Schnatterly
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Steve Grisetti




Location: Orlando metro area, Florida, USA
Joined: 01 Mar 2004
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PostPosted: Mon 01 Aug, 2005 4:24 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Excellent point, Aaron. Just the other day, my wife was asking if my pointies are covered under our homeowners insurance. My tepid response was, "well,...umm...I think so??? Confused " Time to place the call to my agent!
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Aaron Schnatterly




Location: New Glarus, WI
Joined: 16 Feb 2005
Reading list: 67 books

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Posts: 1,244

PostPosted: Mon 01 Aug, 2005 4:39 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Steve Grisetti wrote:
Excellent point, Aaron. Just the other day, my wife was asking if my pointies are covered under our homeowners insurance. My tepid response was, "well,...umm...I think so??? Confused " Time to place the call to my agent!


I'd actually be hesitant to jump on a rider on your homeowner's insurance... make sure you and the agent fully understand what's up.

-Aaron Schnatterly
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Steve Fabert





Joined: 03 Mar 2004
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PostPosted: Mon 01 Aug, 2005 5:22 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

As an attorney who reads and interprets insurance policies every day, I recommend that each of you who feels a desire to obtain insurance for your arms collection write your insurance agent to ask for a quote rather than just placing a phone call. Homeowners policies use a wide range of forms that differ greatly from company to company and state to state. Many insurance agents are not especially well trained in telling you reliably whether you will or will not have coverage for a specific described loss under a particular form. If you ever need to make a claim under your policy, having the agent's promise in writing that he will obtain coverage for the property described in your letter is your security blanket. That way the agent's errors and omissions coverage will pay your loss if he turns out to know too little about the coverage actually provided by the forms used in the policy he sells you.

Standard homeowners coverage will cover liability claims that arise on your premises from activities that are not business related. So having a friend injured while he is over to look at your swords is likely to be covered, as long as you are not trying to make any money.
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Patrick Kelly




Location: Wichita, Kansas
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PostPosted: Mon 01 Aug, 2005 8:32 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

What company are you insure through Aaron? I had my collection covered under my homeowners insurance when I bought my house without a problem.

And forget about waivers for cutting parties. Waivers aren't worth the paper they're printed on.

"In valor there is hope.".................. Tacitus
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Russ Ellis
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PostPosted: Tue 02 Aug, 2005 8:41 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Patrick Kelly wrote:

And forget about waivers for cutting parties. Waivers aren't worth the paper they're printed on.


I'd been told that too. One of the reasons I won't host one, no matter how much I like you guys... Happy

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Joe Fults




Location: Midwest
Joined: 02 Sep 2003

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PostPosted: Tue 02 Aug, 2005 10:38 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Russ Ellis wrote:
Patrick Kelly wrote:

And forget about waivers for cutting parties. Waivers aren't worth the paper they're printed on.


I'd been told that too. One of the reasons I won't host one, no matter how much I like you guys... Happy


More or less same thing here.

"Our life is what our thoughts make it"
-Marcus Aurelius

"Those who make peaceful revolution impossible will make violent revolution inevitable."
-John F. Kennedy
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Thomas Jason




Location: New Joisey
Joined: 28 Jul 2004

Posts: 230

PostPosted: Tue 02 Aug, 2005 11:06 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

I use Collector's Insurance Agency for my Nihonto and custom blades.

They have an extremely good reputation in the Nihonto circles.
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Daniel Parry




Location: UK
Joined: 08 Apr 2005
Reading list: 39 books

Posts: 184

PostPosted: Tue 02 Aug, 2005 11:32 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

If you guys are worried about liability and insurance on your cutting sessions, it might be worth clubbing together your money and asking a US attorney for an overview opinion (but you have separate State laws too don't you ? - don't know if this complicates things). And clarify with your policy providers whether home 3rd party injury policies cover those sorts of events.


I know in the UK it would be a complex issue of tort law in negligence, occupier's liability, vitiating consent (waivers etc), (assuming of course no criminal action) and as the attorney below mentioned 'as long as you're not trying to make any money out of it': then you get into contract law and whether exemptions are allowed for personal injury regardless of waivers etc (aside from the question of whether your home policy covers commercial ventures)



If you want to feel safer, might be worth considering a jointly paid for overall opinion(probably wouldn't cover specifics of your own particular situation).?? And check with insurers. Maybe help you understand the position ?? Don't know.

A thought

Daniel
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Thomas McDonald
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PostPosted: Tue 02 Aug, 2005 3:36 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Thomas Jason wrote:
I use Collector's Insurance Agency for my Nihonto and custom blades.
They have an extremely good reputation in the Nihonto circles.


Hi Thomas

Are these the folks your talking about ? http://www.collectinsure.com/

Thanks, Mac

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