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P Ullrich





Joined: 26 Apr 2013

Posts: 44

PostPosted: Sat 09 Dec, 2017 1:12 pm    Post subject: Landsknecht Emporium         Reply with quote

Just wanted to give everyone a heads up about my recent experiences with Landsknecht Emporium.
Just an FYI.


Last edited by P Ullrich on Fri 22 Dec, 2017 4:50 pm; edited 2 times in total
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Houston P.




Location: United States
Joined: 20 Apr 2015

Posts: 64

PostPosted: Sat 09 Dec, 2017 9:38 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

That's a real shame. I just got a messer he had in stock last Wednesday. I thought I may have found a budget priced maker that actually made really decent swords the way budget swords ought to be- well shaped with great handling, but with no effort on finish or aesthetics whatsoever. I really hope it works out. Please keep us updated if anything changes.
...and he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one. (‭Luke‬ ‭22‬:‭36‬) To be without silver is better than to be without honor. -Norse proverb
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P Ullrich





Joined: 26 Apr 2013

Posts: 44

PostPosted: Sun 10 Dec, 2017 8:54 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Houston, I've read on other forums and blogs positive reviews though most mention poor communication, and it sounds like you got your product so I guess they are hit-miss. Did your order fall on the same timeline as mine? I ordered early October.
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Houston P.




Location: United States
Joined: 20 Apr 2015

Posts: 64

PostPosted: Sun 10 Dec, 2017 2:13 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

I ordered one that he had in stock mid October. I got it after about three weeks. He also never responded to my emails, come to think of it. The only one he sent was a tracking number once the sword was shipped.
...and he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one. (‭Luke‬ ‭22‬:‭36‬) To be without silver is better than to be without honor. -Norse proverb
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Ian Hutchison




Location: Louisiana / Nordrhein-Westholland
Joined: 27 Nov 2007

Posts: 443

PostPosted: Sun 10 Dec, 2017 10:24 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Houston P. wrote:
I ordered one that he had in stock mid October. I got it after about three weeks. He also never responded to my emails, come to think of it. The only one he sent was a tracking number once the sword was shipped.


Is yours a sharp? How is it quality wise? I was looking at some of their sharps but they are almost Albion priced and I have no idea what the blade geometry is like...

'We are told that the pen is mightier than the sword, but I know which of these weapons I would choose.' - Adrian Carton de Wiart


Last edited by Ian Hutchison on Mon 11 Dec, 2017 3:28 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Houston P.




Location: United States
Joined: 20 Apr 2015

Posts: 64

PostPosted: Sun 10 Dec, 2017 11:09 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Mine is sharp. Since I didn't know the maker, I bought one of his cheaper swords to sort of test the waters. It was $325. Handling I'd say is perfect, exactly as it should be. I honestly don't think it could be any better, and I've handled quite a few high end messers/ falchions. It is extremely light, but has a slightly forward weight to ensure it remains a capable cutter. I'd say it was definitely made with function as the foremost thought, which is the way I think all budget swords should be made. The steel is slightly soft. It will take a set if you make a really bad cut. In fact, mine arrived bent. I was able to bend it back across my chest, and now you wouldn't believe it was ever bent. That's not to say it doesn't have a decent heat treat, it will return true in most cases- it's just notably easier to bend than my Albions. I'd say it does so because of the fact that it tapers very dramatically in addition to the slightly softer than optimal steel. It is paper cutting sharp. It has a nice convex edge, but it isn't pefectly ground. If I look down the edge I can see where it is slightly off center in a few spots, but it would be an easy fix. The weak point is the finish. It is very, and I mean very, rough. There are still quite a few obvious grind marks, a couple of spots that are still black from the forge, and allot of places that are uneven on the guard. The guard has a substantial gap, but as the nagel is peened through it is still rock solid. It actually rings like a bell when you flick the blade or guard.The grip is decent. The pins are perfectly flush and the corners are rounded comfortably. The slats are even with the tang in most places and there are no irritating ridges. As for blade geometry, it's really good for the price I paid. It has a slightly hollow ground center and it thickens slightly before the edge. I'd say that if you just look at it closely, it looks quite horrible; but if you hold it with your eyes shut you'd swear it was of the highest quality. All in all I'd say it's great for what I paid, but based on what I'm hearing there's no guarantee you'll get what you ordered unless it was in stock. I really hope he sorts this out as it seems like this is a company with a ton of potential that has a great understanding of how these weapons should function. Hope that helps- Houston
...and he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one. (‭Luke‬ ‭22‬:‭36‬) To be without silver is better than to be without honor. -Norse proverb
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Ian Hutchison




Location: Louisiana / Nordrhein-Westholland
Joined: 27 Nov 2007

Posts: 443

PostPosted: Mon 11 Dec, 2017 3:30 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Thanks for the detailed report, Houston!
'We are told that the pen is mightier than the sword, but I know which of these weapons I would choose.' - Adrian Carton de Wiart
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Adam Bodorics
Industry Professional




Joined: 15 Apr 2005

Posts: 115

PostPosted: Tue 12 Dec, 2017 6:03 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Since I managed to muster the willpower to go on FB today, I guess I should post here as well.
We were hit by a ton of issues, and trying to solve them made me extremely frustrated (understandable, I believe) and unreasonably reclusive (which is not understandable or acceptable at all). At around early September, we were ahead of schedule with all of our orders except one batch. By late September it became clear that the waterjet-cutting company is delayed, and it caused a cascade of further problems. I'm fairly certain that I mentioned this part to you, Phil, though I'm not completely sure. Whenever any of the problems seemed to go away, at least momentarily, I jumped at handling everything at once, including communication. When, in turn, things went back to their earlier belly-up stance, I buried myself in actual work, mostly making hilt accessories in advance and closing myself off from everything more and more.
Anyhow, the batch of blanks we ordered back in... early September arrived 2 weeks ago. Since then we made 24 blades among other stuff, had them heat-treated and cleaned most of them by now, including yours. I haven't checked my paypal in a considerable amount of time, so I'm not aware if you moved forward with the paypal dispute. I don't even know how do those work, like do they need me to actively send you a refund or will they remove the sum automatically. Anyhow, we'll pack the blade up tomorrow (in thicker cardboard than Houston's... I'm truly sorry it arrived bent) and ship it your way. I'm really sorry for this bad experience with us, and with me in particular.
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P Ullrich





Joined: 26 Apr 2013

Posts: 44

PostPosted: Tue 12 Dec, 2017 8:08 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Thanks for the reply, Adam, I'm satisfied with your response. No there was no mention of delays, the last word from you was an estimate of delivery Nov 10, but now I understand the position you're in and appreciate the explanation.
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Joe A




Location: Philadelphia, USA
Joined: 17 Oct 2013

Posts: 52

PostPosted: Wed 13 Dec, 2017 7:30 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Communications from the maker is always good, even if it is bad news it is better than no news.

Happy this ended well.
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Adam Bodorics
Industry Professional




Joined: 15 Apr 2005

Posts: 115

PostPosted: Fri 15 Dec, 2017 1:45 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

I'd consider it ended well when Phil actually receives his blade. That still needs the courier company to send me the shipping documents and the actual courier himself for pickup.

Also, thought I'd share this detail here instead of just telling Phil in private. We assemble most of our Messer models with sliding the cross down from the tip as it's a detail seen on several originals. We like it quite a bit, though it's by no means the only way. As the blade in question widens a bit towards the tip, the very base of the blade has to swell out a bit. The edge bevel curves up to the point of the base, making it the widest and thickest part of the blade, helping to lock the cross in place rather well. Normally, we'd peen the protruding points a bit to lock even more firmly, though a tight tolerance would make it somewhat redundant. This then can be filed or ground flush, or just smoothed down a bit. The shoulder area can be easily reground to accept the cross slid up along the tang, if necessary.
Also we're using square holes for the Nagels, which are 6*6mm (corners obviously radiused). Ideally, the shaft of the Nagel and the holes in the cross itself should conform to this, but it works well with a 6mm round stock too.
I've attached a snapshot of the shoulders, sorry about the quality.



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P Ullrich





Joined: 26 Apr 2013

Posts: 44

PostPosted: Wed 20 Dec, 2017 8:39 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Blade has arrived expertly packed and it is an excellent product. Thanks for the follow-through, Adam.
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Ian Hutchison




Location: Louisiana / Nordrhein-Westholland
Joined: 27 Nov 2007

Posts: 443

PostPosted: Thu 21 Dec, 2017 1:22 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Thanks for the construction details Adam. I love messers and always love to see new ones. Can you tell (or show) me what your distal taper is like?

I looked through some of your older facebook posts and found a very interesting prototype kriegsmesser you made. At the time you were considering adding it to the catalog but said you were going to wait for thicker stock to work from. I'm glad you did this because several of the messers I've bought from other makers have been either too thin at the shoulder or uniform width the entire length of the blade.

'We are told that the pen is mightier than the sword, but I know which of these weapons I would choose.' - Adrian Carton de Wiart
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Adam Bodorics
Industry Professional




Joined: 15 Apr 2005

Posts: 115

PostPosted: Fri 22 Dec, 2017 8:57 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Ian: on the M3C Gottfried models, starting thickness is 5mm, getting down to about 3mm at the beginning of the false edge, measured on the spine. It's rather straightforward, maybe even oversimplified a bit. The fuller and the edge is more complex, and I'm not quite sure if I can describe it correctly. We are still grinding freehanded from waterjet-cut blanks in most cases, and grinding ends when the blade feels good in the hand. Not really the most exact method for sure, but we haven't got any complaints considering handling on Messers so far (or I just missed that message, like I did several).
About those Kriegsmessers - their better versions, along with almost a dozen new prototypes would've been introduced this fall. By now, we wanted to introduce a Katzbalger or two, since as it is right now, we could just rename ourselves as "Those Eternally Late Messer Guys" from Landsknecht Emporium. These plans fell through due to the aforementioned supply issues.
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