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J. Douglas




PostPosted: Sat 11 Mar, 2017 8:25 am    Post subject: Norman maces         Reply with quote

Hello, I'm new here, so I hope I'm doing this right!

Anyway, I have a question. Would a Norman/early medieval mace (a knobbed mace, much like the maces made by the "English cutler" or "Tod's stuff") be effective (by this I mean could you puncture armour or seriously injure the wearer, or would only a flanged mace be effective) against any of the following-

- A 14th century knight/man at arms (in plate armour or a coat of plates with a bascinet or Sallet or other comparable helmet)
-A 15 century knight/man at arms (in full plate armour or a coat of plates, with a Sallet or other suitable helmet)
And
-A 16th century knight or man at arms? ( A fully plate armoured "white armour" knight, with an aramet or similar helmet)

I know the examples of armours for each of the above eras are not completely accurate, but it's just to give you a general idea. And I would imagine all of you would know what armour each would be wearing anyway. Happy

~JD (James)


Last edited by J. Douglas on Sat 11 Mar, 2017 10:43 am; edited 1 time in total
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Mark Moore




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PostPosted: Sat 11 Mar, 2017 9:38 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

I would think that either a knobbed or flanged mace would be equally effective, as the purpose of either one is to deliver a percussive blow---not really so much as to actually *puncture* the armor. A spiked mace, however... Eek! ....McM
''Life is like a box of chocolates...'' --- F. Gump
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J. Douglas




PostPosted: Sat 11 Mar, 2017 9:49 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Mark Moore wrote:
I would think that either a knobbed or flanged mace would be equally effective, as the purpose of either one is to deliver a percussive blow---not really so much as to actually *puncture* the armor. A spiked mace, however... Eek! ....McM


Okay, thank you! I just wasn't sure. Big Grin

~JD (James)


Last edited by J. Douglas on Sat 11 Mar, 2017 10:43 am; edited 1 time in total
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Mark Moore




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PostPosted: Sat 11 Mar, 2017 9:54 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

I will admit, however, that a flanged mace would probably come closer to a puncture than a knobbed version...in my opinion. Happy ...McM
''Life is like a box of chocolates...'' --- F. Gump
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J. Douglas




PostPosted: Sat 11 Mar, 2017 10:00 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Mark Moore wrote:
I will admit, however, that a flanged mace would probably come closer to a puncture than a knobbed version...in my opinion. Happy ...McM


That's probably true, I guess they wouldn't have been developed otherwise.

But, then again, if I thump you over the head with a lump of bronze or iron on the end of a stick I think it will hurt even if it dosent penetrate the armour. Eek!

~JD (James)


Last edited by J. Douglas on Sat 11 Mar, 2017 10:44 am; edited 1 time in total
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Mark Moore




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PostPosted: Sat 11 Mar, 2017 10:03 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Well....I hope you don't do THAT! All of my helmets are only 18 ga. Laughing Out Loud .....McM
''Life is like a box of chocolates...'' --- F. Gump
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J. Douglas




PostPosted: Sat 11 Mar, 2017 10:07 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Mark Moore wrote:
Well....I hope you don't do THAT! All of my helmets are only 18 ga. Laughing Out Loud .....McM



Laughing Out Loud

Don't worry. I won't. I have to raise the money to buy a mace first. Cry

~JD (James)
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Mark Moore




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PostPosted: Sat 11 Mar, 2017 10:14 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Not a mace...a flail....but THIS is my armor-buster. This thing scares the crap out of me. Eek! Laughing Out Loud Laughing Out Loud ....McM


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''Life is like a box of chocolates...'' --- F. Gump
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J. Douglas




PostPosted: Sat 11 Mar, 2017 10:20 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Mark Moore wrote:
Not a mace...a flail....but THIS is my armor-buster. This thing scares the crap out of me. Eek! Laughing Out Loud Laughing Out Loud ....McM


WTF?!

You can have my money!

Laughing Out Loud

That is a very ferocious looking weapon!

Out of curiosity, where do you/where would you store this in a real battle? I know maces and axes would be hung from the belt. but how about your flail?

~JD (James)
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J. Douglas




PostPosted: Sat 11 Mar, 2017 10:23 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

On a similar note, would this be a ceremonial Item, or could it still be used to "bash someone in"?


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~JD (James)


Last edited by J. Douglas on Sat 11 Mar, 2017 10:26 am; edited 1 time in total
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Mark Moore




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PostPosted: Sat 11 Mar, 2017 10:32 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

I don't think this particular flail has much historical precedence....I bought it purely for the "Holy Crap!'' factor. As far as storage...I can't really think of a 'safe' place to put it in a real battle. Maybe in the back of a war-wagon along with spears, two-handed weapons, etc. I, personally, keep it in my 'man-cave' with the door locked. Wink I don't think my wife would like it displayed on the mantle. Laughing Out Loud ....McM
''Life is like a box of chocolates...'' --- F. Gump
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J. Douglas




PostPosted: Sat 11 Mar, 2017 10:37 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Mark Moore wrote:
I don't think this particular flail has much historical precedence....I bought it purely for the "Holy Crap!'' factor. As far as storage...I can't really think of a 'safe' place to put it in a real battle. Maybe in the back of a war-wagon along with spears, two-handed weapons, etc. I, personally, keep it in my 'man-cave' with the door locked. Wink I don't think my wife would like it displayed on the mantle. Laughing Out Loud ....McM


Well, if I were you I'd hang it on the mantle when the in-laws (or any un-wanted visitor) arrvie Laughing Out Loud

Yeh, I think the "holy crap!" Factor would make we want to buy that to. Happy It does look absolutely terrifiyng! WTF?!

~JD (James)
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Mark Moore




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PostPosted: Sat 11 Mar, 2017 10:42 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

As far as the photo you posted, it looks like bronze(?) but I would think it quite capable of ruining someone's day...fast. Wink ...McM
''Life is like a box of chocolates...'' --- F. Gump
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J. Douglas




PostPosted: Sat 11 Mar, 2017 10:46 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Mark Moore wrote:
As far as the photo you posted, it looks like bronze(?) but I would think it quite capable of ruining someone's day...fast. Wink ...McM


Oh, I forgot to say!

It is a Tod's stuff mace, bronze, and I think it was dated from the 11th-13th century.

And yes. I do imagine it would give you a rather sever headache...... Eek!

~JD (James)
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Mark Moore




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PostPosted: Sat 11 Mar, 2017 10:54 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Of course, if you just want to piss someone off.... Laughing Out Loud Laughing Out Loud Laughing Out Loud .....McM


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J. Douglas




PostPosted: Sat 11 Mar, 2017 10:56 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Mark Moore wrote:
Of course, if you just want to piss someone off.... Laughing Out Loud Laughing Out Loud Laughing Out Loud .....McM


Laughing Out Loud Laughing Out Loud Laughing Out Loud Laughing Out Loud

Tickle'im't'death?

~JD (James)
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Mark Moore




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PostPosted: Sat 11 Mar, 2017 10:56 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Sorry to get off-topic. Happy .....McM
''Life is like a box of chocolates...'' --- F. Gump
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J. Douglas




PostPosted: Sat 11 Mar, 2017 11:10 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Yeah, sorry about that.


Also. A random note about the face-mace.

I had an ancestor, called James Douglas the black, he was a freind of Robert the Bruce.

His symbol was the heart (there is a long story behind this) I read somewhere that one of his descendants used a heart-shaped mace in battle. I didn't check the sources of this claim at the time, and I have no idea where I read that info from. But I wonder- Could you there tills make a mace out of any shape? I just don't see how useful a heart shaped mace would be, though. Sad

~JD (James)
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Mark Moore




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PostPosted: Sat 11 Mar, 2017 11:18 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Here you can see the benefit of a flanged-head over a knobbed. Possibly a bit more damaging. Either way, someone on the receiving end is NOT gonna be a happy camper. Big Grin ....McM


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Mark Moore




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PostPosted: Sat 11 Mar, 2017 11:23 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

As far as the shape goes, a heart-shape would be just as effective as any other, in my opinion. A mace, when it all boils down, is pretty much just a weighted club. That's interesting to hear about your ancestry!.....McM
''Life is like a box of chocolates...'' --- F. Gump
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