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Danny Nguyen




Location: Montreal
Joined: 09 Sep 2015

Posts: 23

PostPosted: Sat 28 Nov, 2015 3:25 pm    Post subject: Silk gambeson/arming coat         Reply with quote

I'm trying to built a silk version of the garment. Since my wool gambeson overheats. I already have dupicioni as the inner shell with silk velvet as the outer shell. Could Silk fiber recycled thread work as paddling? As I found 18oz of it for 30$.
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Mart Shearer




Location: Jackson, MS, USA
Joined: 18 Aug 2012

Posts: 1,276

PostPosted: Sat 28 Nov, 2015 5:42 pm    Post subject: Re: Silk gambeson/arming coat         Reply with quote

Danny Nguyen wrote:
I'm trying to built a silk version of the garment. Since my wool gambeson overheats. I already have dupicioni as the inner shell with silk velvet as the outer shell. Could Silk fiber recycled thread work as paddling? As I found 18oz of it for 30$.


Historically the inner shell would be made of less expensive buckram (stout cotton), fustian (a linen-cotton blend), or hemp canvas. Silk for an outer covering is quite appropriate. Many people think Dupioni has too many slubs, but we don't know much about medieval cendal, which was a relatively cheap silk used to cover gambesons and aketons. Old cendal cloth is specified in the 1322 London armourer's regulation, along with caddis (unspecified fluff) for stuffing the new cotton cloth shell. I would say the recycled silk waste should be acceptable.

Quote:
Regulations made by the Armourers of London.
15 Edward 11. A.D. 1322. Letter-Book E. fol. cxxxiii. (Norman French.)
------------
That a haketon and a gambeson covered with sendale, or with cloth of silk, shall be stuffed with new cotton cloth, and with cadaz, and with old sendales, and in no other manner.
And that white haketons shall be stuffed with old woven cloth, and with cotton, and made of new woven cloth within and without.


There is a French regulation requiring a minimum of 3 livres of cotton for stuffing, so you might need another 18 oz. of silk waste, tow, silk rags, or loose cotton.

ferrum ferro acuitur et homo exacuit faciem amici sui
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Danny Nguyen




Location: Montreal
Joined: 09 Sep 2015

Posts: 23

PostPosted: Sun 29 Nov, 2015 11:55 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

3lbs equals to 48 oz. What does the document refer to the one worn under the armor or the stand alone version? I avoid cotton as it heats more than my old model. I'm fairly lean at 130lbs and 5'9" and expected less material, but considering the physique during the middle ages, it would be an accurate estimate.
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Mart Shearer




Location: Jackson, MS, USA
Joined: 18 Aug 2012

Posts: 1,276

PostPosted: Sun 29 Nov, 2015 12:37 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

It's the 1296 Ordonnances des Metiers de Paris, which requires armourers make neither coat nor gambeson with less than 3 livres of cotton (about 50 oz. or 1.48 kg) to be used for the fill along with rags or fabric scraps. Laws like this are usually enacted because someone tried to use less fill (since it's hidden from view) to save production costs while cheating the buyer.

While the regulation doesn't state whether this is a to be worn in conjunction with armor or by itself, we have accounts of knights wearing a gambeson, mail, and a sleeveless gambeson over the mail. Expect it to retain body heat, regardless of the type of filling material: cotton, tow, wool, silk, etc..

ferrum ferro acuitur et homo exacuit faciem amici sui
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