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Thomas Drown




Location: United States
Joined: 04 Apr 2015

Posts: 1

PostPosted: Sat 04 Apr, 2015 10:42 am    Post subject: Colonial Doglock Musket?         Reply with quote

Hello, I'm new to this forum so please bear with me if I make any mistakes. I am very very interested in the 18th century colonial period in America. That being said I'm looking for a good reproduction doglock musket. Having no experience with black-powder, much less early flintlocks, I turn to the vast experience you all have to recommend a good company. I have seen a number of company's that offer reproductions of 18th century English colonial doglock's but it seems that they universally have very mixed reviews. My period of interest is from about 1630 to 1700 Colonial militia from Massachusetts Bay Colony to the Virginia Militia, and the Carolina's. I've attached an Osprey photo that inspired this inquiry for a kind of reference. Thank you all for any help you can give.


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Tom King




Location: florida
Joined: 11 Sep 2009
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PostPosted: Sat 04 Apr, 2015 8:02 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

http://www.myArmoury.com/review_mvt_doglock.html

They are all the same pistols/rifles made by the same indian workshop. Middlesex village trading and militaryheritage.com both sell them, although the latter ships without the touch hole drilled.

I've always wanted one, and once held one and considered buying it. For $350-400(pistol) and $500-700(rifle) respectively they are decent pieces for shooting and reenacting the 17th century anglosphere.


Last edited by Tom King on Mon 06 Apr, 2015 11:28 am; edited 1 time in total
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Jean Thibodeau




Location: Montreal,Quebec,Canada
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PostPosted: Sat 04 Apr, 2015 8:42 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Here are some links to those pistols and muskets using the doglock:

http://www.middlesexvillagetrading.com/PDOG.shtml

http://www.middlesexvillagetrading.com/MEL.shtml


http://www.loyalistarms.freeservers.com/englishlockmusket.htm


I have one of the pistols, and it look great, but I can't personally tell you how it shoots since I have the " undrilled touch hole version " so that I don't need to register it as a restricted weapon in Canada: No point going through that bureaucratic process if I only have it for display purposes.

Having a gunsmith drill the touch hole would be simple enough if I ever decided to shoot it in the future, but I would have to have some paperwork done first for it to be legal.

Not an issue for you in the U.S.A., depending on state or city laws where you live having the touch hole drilled for the pistol, and even less so for the musket version I would guess ?

You can easily give up your freedom. You have to fight hard to get it back!
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Lin Robinson




Location: NC
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PostPosted: Sun 05 Apr, 2015 4:10 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Gordon's review of his pistol was interesting and certainly favorable and I think he got a pretty good one. However, be warned that the quality of these Indian made firearms varies dramatically and you may wind up with a gun that you would be afraid to fire! These guns are not proof tested by their makers or distributors although I believe there is one Canadian firm which provides information on how to do your own proofing, a practice that I would not advocate for the average person. If you plan to fire only blank charges then I would not be too concerned with proving the barrel but if you want to shoot live ammo....the decision is yours but I would be very cautious.

The next potential issue comes from the locks. Many of the frizzens are not properly hardened and will not spark well. They can be re-hardened but the process will be difficult for anyone without experience or a good mentor. The springs in these locks also run from mushy to so heavy that flints last a very short time. If any of the parts in the lock break you may find it difficult, probably impossible, to find drop-in parts. A custom maker can accommodate you but at a price.

The teak that is used in most of the stocks, while it makes really good boat decks, does not seem to work very well for gun stocks. Soft spots and voids are frequently found in the stocks.

All that being said, I have dealt with Middlesex Village and they do a pretty good job of checking out the guns before they ship. They also drill touch holes and make adjustments to the locks - at least they say they do - to improve function. The only thing I have of theirs is a "Murdoch" Scottish pistol. The lock on this gun has very heavy springs and it destroys flints very quickly. I happen to know this has been a problem with more guns than just mine. The gun, over all, is very "clunky" compared to originals but the price is not bad and it looks OK.

If you are interested in a custom made gun and have the funds, check out www.trackofthewolf.com. They have used and new guns for sale and from time to time will have a dog lock. Just be prepared to pay a lot more than what you would from Loyalist Arms or Middlesex Village. However, you will get a very good quality firearm that you can be comfortable shooting from Track.

Lin Robinson

"The best thing in life is to crush your enemies, see them driven before you and hear the lamentation of their women." Conan the Barbarian, 1982
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Raymond Deancona





Joined: 04 Mar 2004

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PostPosted: Mon 06 Apr, 2015 6:40 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

If you are in the Eastern Pennsylvania area (or don't mind a car trip) I would also recommend Dixon's Muzzle loading. They carry some of the pieces mentioned, but they are also a full service gunsmith specifically for the black powder shooter. All the problems Lin listed they can deal with, correct, and offer a shootable firearm. They also have the more expensive European made guns as well as custom made guns.

They can also help with any and all question from a new devotee of black powder.
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Tom King




Location: florida
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PostPosted: Mon 06 Apr, 2015 11:16 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

To add, if you have a few month-years to develop your reenactment kit and have a functional home workshop, the best reproductions seem to come from http://therifleshoppe.com/. I have seen a few kits people have put together in the st. Augustine area reenactment circuit and they are excellent. Be warned though, for you $800-1000+ you may end up waiting for up to years until it ships (small company; it is rumored that they save money by making a run of lock castings/barrels/etc. once they get a certain number of orders to complete for less popular items) . and then you have to build it. Not for the faint of heart, but for those that take the plunge the result seems to be worth it.
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Lin Robinson




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PostPosted: Mon 06 Apr, 2015 3:12 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Tom King wrote:
To add, if you have a few month-years to develop your reenactment kit and have a functional home workshop, the best reproductions seem to come from http://therifleshoppe.com/. I have seen a few kits people have put together in the st. Augustine area reenactment circuit and they are excellent. Be warned though, for you $800-1000+ you may end up waiting for up to years until it ships (small company; it is rumored that they save money by making a run of lock castings/barrels/etc. once they get a certain number of orders to complete for less popular items) . and then you have to build it. Not for the faint of heart, but for those that take the plunge the result seems to be worth it.


Tom...in MOST cases when dealing with TRS you are talking YEARS, not months. They provide very good stuff, when they provide it but there are forums which deal only with firearms where you will hear nothing but complaints about their service or lack thereof. The parts are also rough cast and unless you know what you are doing, a project using their stuff can be a real challenge. I will say that there are others out there who will build guns from their parts to order but do not know what kind of experience the builders have had getting the components.

Leonard Day would also be an excellent choice. Don't have contact info right now but will look for it.

Lin Robinson

"The best thing in life is to crush your enemies, see them driven before you and hear the lamentation of their women." Conan the Barbarian, 1982
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Raymond Deancona





Joined: 04 Mar 2004

Posts: 429

PostPosted: Mon 06 Apr, 2015 3:42 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Dixon's is also a good place to make your own - they keep an excellent supply of parts, barrels, stocks. Though it is not for the first time maker!
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Brett Farnum





Joined: 11 Dec 2007

Posts: 2

PostPosted: Wed 08 Apr, 2015 7:43 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

I own and fire several of the arms mentioned with both live rounds and blanks, so I'll add my two cents. However, Keep in mind I don't consider myself a black powder expert.

I have purchased replicas from a variety of sources and by far the best quality has come from Middlesex trading. In particular I would advise purchasing the fishtail doglock musket from them. I originally had a less expensive version from Track of the Wolf but the workmanship was not as good and in the long run I didn't save any money.

I'll also mention that I have had quite a bit of work done by Earl Kathan of flintlockrepair.com. He has plenty of experience keeping Indian replicas working and has been able to bail me out of trouble on many occasions.
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