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Radovan Geist




Location: Slovakia
Joined: 19 Aug 2010
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PostPosted: Mon 28 Oct, 2013 11:55 pm    Post subject: strange helmet - some help needed         Reply with quote

Recently I´ve been to Brussels and visited the Army Museum. Its collections are not large (unless you are interested in 19th and 20th century, and specially in Belgian army:)), but it has some interesting pieces. Among them I´ve found also this strange helmet (the one on the left). It´s made of iron, shaped like a hat that was used at those times in Lower Countries and Germany, but the overall finish is not perfect (note large and no so well fitting rivets). It was dated to late 16th century, if I remember well (I forgot to take picture of the exhibit info, my bad!). So, the questions are:

- have you ever come across similar helmet? surviving originals, pictures, descriptions... any sourcing would greatly help.
- why this untidy finish? do you think it would be covered by some fabric / leather? or any other reason?

thanks in advance for any suggestion or advice.



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Stephen Wheatley




Location: DORSET ENGLAND
Joined: 15 Nov 2008

Posts: 91

PostPosted: Tue 29 Oct, 2013 1:40 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

It looks like a French 17th century ''iron hat'' - I've seen one in the French military museum, better quality with a raised brim to resemble a civilian beaver hat and a sliding noseguard. I don't know whether they were originally covered with felt or not but have also seen them depicted as being worn in the ECW. Apart from that, there are the well-known ''secrets'' worn inside civilian hats at the time, and Bradshaw's reinforced hat from the trial of Charles 1.
Stephen Wheatley
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Radovan Geist




Location: Slovakia
Joined: 19 Aug 2010
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Posts: 358

PostPosted: Tue 29 Oct, 2013 2:25 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Thank you! That info on Bradshaw´s hat is interesting, I have not spotted it before. I will also try to search more on those French hats you´ve mentioned.
I know about "secrets" but always thought they were rather scull-shaped. In fact, that museum in Brussels has one on exhibit - an interesting scull-shaped piece, not full-plate but only reinforcing metal ribs.
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Radovan Geist




Location: Slovakia
Joined: 19 Aug 2010
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PostPosted: Tue 29 Oct, 2013 2:38 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Stephen, only now I have noticed that old thread you´ve resurrected - thank you!
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Stephen Wheatley




Location: DORSET ENGLAND
Joined: 15 Nov 2008

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PostPosted: Tue 29 Oct, 2013 2:54 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

A pleasure Radovan - I reckon they must have been French originally, some making their way to England and the low countries. I wonder if they were at all practical!
Stephen Wheatley
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Jeffrey Hildebrandt
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Location: Canada
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PostPosted: Tue 29 Oct, 2013 6:23 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

An interesting and attractive form of helmet. Here are a few example that haven't shown up in this thread or the other iron hat thread:

an interesting example with a fluted skull in the Higgins, said to be from Flanders, c.1630-50:

http://higgins.lostpapyr.us/artifacts/2958

and one dated c.1630 in the Met, which is "possibly British":

http://www.metmuseum.org/Collections/search-t...&pos=3

-Hildebrandt

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Radovan Geist




Location: Slovakia
Joined: 19 Aug 2010
Likes: 5 pages

Posts: 358

PostPosted: Tue 29 Oct, 2013 11:15 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

thanks for those additional pictures - the fluted one is a really interesting specie. I would also wonder about their practicability, but I fully agree that they´re attractive - or for sure eccentric Happy If I once manage to make an officers kit for the later part of 30 years war (1630s, 1640s), I will probably get one of these helms.
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