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Peter Messent




Location: Texas
Joined: 03 Jan 2009

Posts: 226

PostPosted: Mon 06 May, 2013 4:50 pm    Post subject: Deepeeka Triple-Lobed Godfred: A brief look         Reply with quote

Howdy folks,
I've had a very busy day, so I wouldn't say this is an exhaustive review, but I received my new Triple-Lobed Godfred from Kult of Athena today and wanted to share some pictures and thoughts. For those unaware, Deepeeka is a VERY affordable brand of arms and armor located in India. They have in the past been, at best, hit or miss. However, they do look to be devoting a lot of effort to upgrading their line to be more accurate and more usable while maintaining that price point. This sword cost me $142 delivered.






Naturally, the scabbard caught my eye first. I have to say that I'm pleased with it - I like that it uses a leather chape rather than the usual metal. The scabbard appears to be wood with a leather outer; a leather lining as well, though I'm not sure if this goes the whole way. The sword does not rattle and it is a good, snug fit. The hilt is wrapped leather and seems decent enough, if not my preference.


In this photo you can see a bit of a gap; the scabbard mouth needs a bit more of a curve to fit the crossguard. Easy fix, though.



The fuller is relatively good; it is very well defined. It does terminate a bit too soon though, it would look better if it continued a bit below the guard. The tip of the sword is a flattened-diamond cross section rather than lenticular, unfortunately very common on swords of this price range. I think the fuller should probably also extend further, given that it was terminated 'deliberately' rather than due to blade taper; ie, the blade gets thicker immediately after the fuller.


The edge is thick; I've started sharpening it, but it will be a minute!


This was a little disappointing for me. The blade is recessed on one side and only one side! I'm not sure why this happened, but naturally, the recess in the crossguard should cover the whole width of the blade.


No foolin' rivets! The pommel is two piece, with an upper guard riveted to a pommel.


The tang does, however, still go all the way through the pommel. Iti s a good peen, though, and smoothing it out is top of the list for me.


Pommel-upper guard fit is not perfect and the wire wrap is a little loose - but I do think it's simply awesome that there's a sword with a two-part pommel, including wire wrap, for this price, so I think it's forgivable.


The hilt is rather long for a viking sword, allowing a comfortable hammer grip. I consider this a redeeming quality, as it means that the peen can be ground off and the hilt components tidied up a bit, and the grip shortened at the same time.

General thoughts? I think that this is a very good effort within this price range. I think I would like a broader and longer fuller, though. I think that the blade recess in the crossguard needs to be fixed and it would be nice if the parts fit together a little better- but it is worth noting that it is solid, with no rock, wiggle or rattle. The parts are a little off-center, the edges on the lobate pommel not quite rounded enough - but what do you expect for this price? I think this is a good sword for the price. I do, however, think that the Deepeeka Hersir sword will be better - simpler design makes for easier execution. I am pleased enough with this sword that I'm buying another, and that will be the Hersir.

Way to go Deepeeka for making this big step into much better swords - a little tidying up and you'll be golden!
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Greg Ballantyne




Location: Maryland USA
Joined: 14 Feb 2011
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Posts: 233

PostPosted: Mon 06 May, 2013 5:05 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Thanks for the review Peter, nice photos and description. I've been curious about this new Deepeeka effort. Since you have one of them, when you've got a little more time we'd also be curious about handling, pob, percussion, and that sort of thing.....?
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Peter Messent




Location: Texas
Joined: 03 Jan 2009

Posts: 226

PostPosted: Mon 06 May, 2013 5:43 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Thanks for reminding me about that Greg, like I said I had a long day Big Grin

The POB is right around 6.5" from the cross. The COP is about 7" from the tip, by my reckoning - the blade is quite thick, so it didn't have the lively sinusoidal vibration that some thinner blades do - I'm hoping that this will make it a better cutter. It is of a noticeable weight (the battery on my scale died when i tried to weigh it earlier, but KoA puts it at about 2.5lb) but handles well, as far as I'm concerned - the main let down on handling is that long grip - I find it difficult to settle a grip around this size into a comfortable handshake grip. I'll work on that when I get it sharp enough to do some cutting, though.

The blade is a hair under 5mm at the cross and about 4mm at the end of the fuller.

Handling wise, I would say that this blade could be improved most by a broader fuller. I think that would make a very lively viking sword.

I don't do steel-on-steel, but I would be very interested in how one of the 'fighter' versions held up to reenactment. I didn't do a heavy flex test, but I bent it about 45 degrees and it returned true. My work in sharpening it would suggest it is of adequate hardness.

Thanks,
Pete
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Nick Hallacher





Joined: 12 Aug 2011

Posts: 23

PostPosted: Tue 07 May, 2013 1:46 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

As soon as the Hersir is available it is on my list. Thanks for this quick review, highly appreciated!

http://www.armae.com/moyenage/epee_medievale/..._SW239.htm More pictures of the Hersir, they don't have it listed on their English site.

Also it appears the hersir is available from Wulflund: http://www.wulflund.com/weapons/swords/viking...plica.html
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P. Schontzler




Location: WA, USA
Joined: 15 Apr 2013

Posts: 99

PostPosted: Tue 07 May, 2013 11:45 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

The Hersir looks to have the same length of grip to me. Both are 37" with 30" blades.
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Peter Messent




Location: Texas
Joined: 03 Jan 2009

Posts: 226

PostPosted: Tue 07 May, 2013 1:43 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

No problem Nick! Thanks for the pic, I want it even more now. I'm going to have Kult of Athena order the Hersir, I think. Birthday next month! Big Grin

P. Schontzler wrote:
The Hersir looks to have the same length of grip to me. Both are 37" with 30" blades.


According to the Deepeeka website they are different lengths but either way, both the cross and pommel look like they contribute more of that in the Hersir than the Godfred. It could just be an illusion because the Hersir blade is .5" wider, but the Hersir looks better proportioned to me.

I got this sword sharp today and it performs well, I only cut a couple bottles as it still has work to be done on refining the edge. I'm also part way through replacing the grip, as it just bothers me - I like the hourglass shape, personally, so I'm giving that a try. I think it will help make up for the long grip when it comes to holding it hand-shake style.
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P. Schontzler




Location: WA, USA
Joined: 15 Apr 2013

Posts: 99

PostPosted: Tue 07 May, 2013 2:12 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Yeah, you're right. The Hersir definitely has a thicker guard and pommel. Hard to stay though without actually measuring the grips, because the Hersir is shorter by 0.5" but the blade is 1.5" shorter. Definitely wider, 2.3" vs 1.8."
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P. Schontzler




Location: WA, USA
Joined: 15 Apr 2013

Posts: 99

PostPosted: Tue 07 May, 2013 2:17 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Peter Messent wrote:
No problem Nick! Thanks for the pic, I want it even more now. I'm going to have Kult of Athena order the Hersir, I think. Birthday next month! Big Grin


Did KoA mention when then would stock it? My birthday is coming up too!
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Reece Nelson




Location: Overland Park KS
Joined: 18 Oct 2007
Likes: 2 pages

Posts: 257

PostPosted: Tue 07 May, 2013 2:18 pm    Post subject: Deepeeka viking sword         Reply with quote

So did this sword come blunt? I know Deepeeka is geared towards a lot of reenactors...

Also is the hilt furniture mild steel?

Great review!

-Reece
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Peter Messent




Location: Texas
Joined: 03 Jan 2009

Posts: 226

PostPosted: Tue 07 May, 2013 2:35 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

P. Schontzler - I agree, it is rather difficult to say - I don't see why that isn't a standard specification when listing swords, it is certainly a significant one! I don't know if KoA has any plans to stock it, I'll shoot them an e-mail. Someone pointed out to me in another thread, though, that they will order Deepeeka products upon request, which is what I was planning to do.

Reece - yes, it did come blunt. To the best of my knowledge India requires sword (not sure about knife) exports to be blunt, by law - I believe that the sharpening of windlass swords is done in the country of purchase rather than India. They do apparently offer two versions, supposedly identical except for one having a thicker edge for reenactors - I have no idea which one I have! I think that the furniture is mild steel, but to be honest, I haven't checked! I'll try a dab of gun blue in a bit to see what happens - the glue is setting on the grip riser right now so it's all bound up.
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P. Schontzler




Location: WA, USA
Joined: 15 Apr 2013

Posts: 99

PostPosted: Tue 07 May, 2013 3:55 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Peter Messent wrote:
P. Schontzler - I agree, it is rather difficult to say - I don't see why that isn't a standard specification when listing swords, it is certainly a significant one! I don't know if KoA has any plans to stock it, I'll shoot them an e-mail. Someone pointed out to me in another thread, though, that they will order Deepeeka products upon request, which is what I was planning to do.


I was the one that pointed it out to you actually. I was hoping you'd inquired already. Happy
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Peter Messent




Location: Texas
Joined: 03 Jan 2009

Posts: 226

PostPosted: Tue 07 May, 2013 4:13 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Sorry, my memory isn't what I think it once might have been Laughing Out Loud I sent out an e-mail, hopefully I'll get a response tomorrow!
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Peter Messent




Location: Texas
Joined: 03 Jan 2009

Posts: 226

PostPosted: Tue 07 May, 2013 4:18 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Forgot to add - I did just try the gun blue and the hilt furniture does appear to be mild steel. Might have to blue it and see how it looks! Might look rather good with an oxblood wrap.
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Ian Hutchison




Location: Louisiana / Nordrhein-Westholland
Joined: 27 Nov 2007

Posts: 486

PostPosted: Tue 07 May, 2013 5:04 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

I am definitely surprised by the sheath, and the sword is certainly better than those before it. Now that I've seen the hersir, it looks even better. It has the two-piece pommel, a sheath with a bridge, and the fuller extends to the tang.
'We are told that the pen is mightier than the sword, but I know which of these weapons I would choose.' - Adrian Carton de Wiart
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Lin Robinson




Location: NC
Joined: 15 Jun 2006
Likes: 6 pages
Reading list: 6 books

Posts: 1,217

PostPosted: Tue 07 May, 2013 5:08 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

While there is, of course, a vast difference between a sword and a shield, I recently got my hands on a new Deepeeka version of a Scottish Targe. I have to say that I am impressed with its construction and appearance. When I get a moment I will photograph it and post the particulars. It is a significantly better shield than what Hanwei provided a few years back. I echo that they seem to be trying to make their products more authentic and with better construction.
Lin Robinson

"The best thing in life is to crush your enemies, see them driven before you and hear the lamentation of their women." Conan the Barbarian, 1982
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Greg Ballantyne




Location: Maryland USA
Joined: 14 Feb 2011
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Posts: 233

PostPosted: Tue 07 May, 2013 5:25 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

KOA lists the grip length at 4". That might not be long for some, I think I'd like it. I've got a Viking reproduction sword with a 4 1/4" grip, which turns out to be a snug fit for me in the hammer grip. I see what you mean regarding the fuller width, and by your description of the blade it doesn't sound like it has much in the way of distal taper, but at that price point you can't expect everything. But it does sound like Deepeeka is making strides toward improvement in their product line. Perhaps there is more to come....
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Peter Messent




Location: Texas
Joined: 03 Jan 2009

Posts: 226

PostPosted: Tue 07 May, 2013 8:03 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Ian - aye, the Hersir looks better all-round, I think. The blade looks beautiful - I do like how well-defined the fullers are. For the record, I can't remember if I mentioned, but the fullers are not just a circular section - more like a semi-ovoid shape, with relatively steep sides going into a more subtle rounded bottom. Personally, I love the look.

The sheaths I do think are remarkable - this one is pretty modest but the Hersir one looks great - how is it that a $250 Windlass viking sword has a one-piece cast pommel with a terrible scabbard and a $130 deepeeka viking sword has a two-piece pommel and a leather-over-wood sheath with relatively historically accurate fittings? That don't make sense to me!

Lin - that's good to hear also!

Greg - aye mine is about 4 1/4" - I know it's not very long, and I don't have small hands (I'm 6'4") but I generally find that a large grip is actually more, rather than less uncomfortable in either grip - the handshake doesn't feel secure and there's too much movement in the hammer, so the pommel gets my wrist. With the new grip on it though, it feels much better - I do love an hourglass-shaped grip on a viking sword. For comparison though, i did a new grip on a windlass viking not that long ago and it wound up at about 3.5".

You're right that the blade doesn't have much distal taper - I think that the only taper it has came as a side-effect of grinding due to the slight taper in the blade profile. I think it handles pretty well in spite of that though - if they continued the fuller a few inches further and just thinned out the tip into a nice lenticular section, it would be even better.

I do think they will improve further over time - hopefully their workers will get more accustomed to the new products and the symmetry will start improving. From what I've seen, these new swords do require a lot more parts to fit together than they did in the past. I talked briefly with Mr Agarwal about his new line, and he seems dedicated to moving Deepeeka in a positive and more accurate direction, which is great.

Pete
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Gregory J. Liebau




Location: Dinuba, CA
Joined: 27 Nov 2004

Posts: 669

PostPosted: Tue 07 May, 2013 11:16 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Thanks very much for this interesting review. I read through most of the previous conversation sparked by this sword before anyone seems to have laid hands on it. Several years back, when I first started collecting swords, I bought eight Deepeeka swords in a row. I've only owned one Albion "squire line" and a couple of Hanwei swords since then, but have handled many other products. I can only say that all eight of those Deepeeka swords were absolutely crappy by comparison.

This is an inspiring step forward for a vendor that I had almost completely lost hope in when it came down to making bladed weapons. Huzzah!

-Gregory
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Peter Messent




Location: Texas
Joined: 03 Jan 2009

Posts: 226

PostPosted: Wed 08 May, 2013 11:52 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Interesting to hear with someone who had a previous bad experience Gregory - let us know what you think if you get a chance to handle one of these new ones, a side-by-side comparison between old and new would be cool!

Well folks, I have one last thing to add to my thoughts on this sword, that came about while I was redoing the grip.


They weren't lying, the tang is beefy! What is that we spy on the upper and lower guard, though?



This struck me as being so bizarre that I didn't even know how to react. These recesses are for the grip to fit into - I guess so that the ends of the grip don't have to be radiused to fit the guards? It seems pretty weird to me though, especially given that these recesses fit the grip fine whereas the recess for the blade wasn't wide/deep enough. Anyway, I just used these as spots to put epoxy to help secure everything in place. The crossguard was free to move once I got the grip off - the pommel stayed fast, so I made sure to size the grip a little long so it would wedge everything solidly in place. For the record, these aren't terribly deep - I just find it weird that they're there at all. My grip was large enough to cover them completely.

Anyway, on with what I've done to it.


I smoothed out the peen on the pommel and used a dremel to neaten up some of the lines of it. Following that, I wire brushed the whole deal - i thought about polishing it, but I wouldn't be happy with it without disassembling the pommel and upper guard which I didn't want to do.


I started flattening the diamond cross section into a lenticular - still has a ways to go. Photos are unforgiving!


I replaced the grip with an hour-glass type with a riser in the middle. The riser is partially just because I like that look, but also because I find it makes the handshake more secure. The guards and pommel were blued and the grip was dyed ox blood. I felt that this pick of colors would help to tone down the asymmetry of the components, and I think that was achieved.


The sword in its entirety. I'm very pleased with how this sword has turned out. A bit more work on flattening the tip and I'll be happier!

As for the sheath, I'm not sure what to do - I removed the straps so I could put on a strap bridge, but I'm not sure how the brown scabbard goes with the black/red handle - at the same time, I feel that a black and red sheath might be a bit much. Suggestions would be most welcome.

For the record, I got an e-mail from Kult of Athena - they are ordering the Hersir sword and will have it when their distributor does. It will be priced the same as this one - $129.95. Great news!

Thanks for looking,
Pete
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P. Schontzler




Location: WA, USA
Joined: 15 Apr 2013

Posts: 99

PostPosted: Wed 08 May, 2013 12:14 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Thanks for the update, Peter! Looks great, way to make it your own.

You could try darkening the scabbard to a much darker brown, it might blend better with the hilt. (don't ask me how to do that though!)
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