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Lancelot Chan
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PostPosted: Sat 11 Aug, 2012 6:42 am    Post subject: Sparring with a Toyama Ryu friend         Reply with quote

http://youtu.be/rlzwF3qpXcs

Practiced sparring with our friend Toyama Ryu Jack who practices katana for 30 rounds.

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Jean Thibodeau




PostPosted: Sat 11 Aug, 2012 7:35 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Your usual domination by controlling distance efficiently, but I think I noticed that your opponent is telegraphing the timing of his attacks much more than you do.

In a few cases he scored against you when he waited for you to attack and it's mostly when he tries to attack first that he moves his feet first and signals his attack: To be more successful he need to sneak into measure and use time of the hand more. Wink

But you seem to be difficult to sneak up on. Big Grin Cool

Just some minor adjustments to his timing and the range at which he initiates his attacks and his effectiveness would go up by 2 or 3X.

Oh, could be wrong here but I think many styles of Japanese sword have the right leg leading, and this in part because a Katana is usually shorter than a European longsword: With the German longsword with the left leg forward one can simply withdraw the left leg when it is attacked and void the leg attack ..... Am I correct here ? I did take a one day seminar our group had with Japanese Katana and I noticed that the leading leg was most often the opposite of the leading leg using the longsword. ( In other words attacks to the legs a lot more difficult and dangerous to attempt with the European longsword ).

When you are attacking, even when you rarely telegraph a little bit, you got close enough in measure that he doesn't have the reaction time needed to defend properly.

One thing about the scoring and my perceptions is that a killing blow is often followed by a hit by the other that might not happen if it was a real fight ( Dead or incapacitated ), but in some cases a dying opponent might still get to you, so defending after a good hit is something to try to improve as a wounded opponent might not drop instantly.

I'm guessing that you count it as a " Yellow " or " White double kill " when the delay between the kill and the following blow is very short and assume that a longer delay is simply that in practice the defeated opponent doesn't have the reaction time to stop a blow already initiated.

In any case I really enjoy seeing your sparring videos.

Oh, and he did get you really well at least a couple of times. Wink Big Grin If you are in a way also teaching and not just bouting, being proud of a student winning against you is something to be happy and proud about, and a learning experience to also become better.

You can easily give up your freedom. You have to fight hard to get it back!
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Lancelot Chan
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Location: Hong Kong
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PostPosted: Sat 11 Aug, 2012 8:44 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

The Gekken (sparring) training regime in Hong Kong Toyama Ryu is mostly based on kendo training. I think he was not used to having his hands and legs being attacked at. I've taken note about this and hit him at the hands and legs whenever possible.

I agree with you that the measure of Katana maybe different, due to its shorter length. Shorter length means less safety margin for reaction time. Thus when they move, they usually move with their front leg stepping forward, for a shorter distance advance, but also quicker.

You're right if he could sneak into measure, he will have much better chance in getting me. Katana is very light to him, for he weighs more than I do! Getting close would not be a good situation for me for he could change directions much faster than I could.

You're right about the score-marking. We only count red when in sharp swords cases, the following hits would not land. Yellow for a hit that would land but not disabling. White for those that would land and were equally disabling / killing. The time between the hits is also taken into consideration. We only count those "dying strike" that were set into action already when the victim was hit. So you're assumption is totally on mark!

He was among the best sparring swordsman at his school, with 8 years under the belt. I've no doubt he'll adapt and improve very quickly. This is one of the very friendly sparring, thus we were both testing out our techniques instead of "going for the most victories".

I enjoy this type of sparring more, for both parties can learn in a safe and happy environment.

Jean Thibodeau wrote:
Your usual domination by controlling distance efficiently, but I think I noticed that your opponent is telegraphing the timing of his attacks much more than you do.

In a few cases he scored against you when he waited for you to attack and it's mostly when he tries to attack first that he moves his feet first and signals his attack: To be more successful he need to sneak into measure and use time of the hand more. Wink

But you seem to be difficult to sneak up on. Big Grin Cool

Just some minor adjustments to his timing and the range at which he initiates his attacks and his effectiveness would go up by 2 or 3X.

Oh, could be wrong here but I think many styles of Japanese sword have the right leg leading, and this in part because a Katana is usually shorter than a European longsword: With the German longsword with the left leg forward one can simply withdraw the left leg when it is attacked and void the leg attack ..... Am I correct here ? I did take a one day seminar our group had with Japanese Katana and I noticed that the leading leg was most often the opposite of the leading leg using the longsword. ( In other words attacks to the legs a lot more difficult and dangerous to attempt with the European longsword ).

When you are attacking, even when you rarely telegraph a little bit, you got close enough in measure that he doesn't have the reaction time needed to defend properly.

One thing about the scoring and my perceptions is that a killing blow is often followed by a hit by the other that might not happen if it was a real fight ( Dead or incapacitated ), but in some cases a dying opponent might still get to you, so defending after a good hit is something to try to improve as a wounded opponent might not drop instantly.

I'm guessing that you count it as a " Yellow " or " White double kill " when the delay between the kill and the following blow is very short and assume that a longer delay is simply that in practice the defeated opponent doesn't have the reaction time to stop a blow already initiated.

In any case I really enjoy seeing your sparring videos.

Oh, and he did get you really well at least a couple of times. Wink Big Grin If you are in a way also teaching and not just bouting, being proud of a student winning against you is something to be happy and proud about, and a learning experience to also become better.

Ancient Combat Association http://www.acahk.org
Realistic Sparring Weapons http://www.rsw.com.hk
Nightstalkers http://www.nightstalkers.com.hk
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Kurt Scholz





Joined: 09 Dec 2008

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PostPosted: Sun 12 Aug, 2012 12:45 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

:thumbs up: interesting, btw. How is the concept of mensur - distance control - accounted for in kendo or do they generally have less emphasis on refined stealth footwork?
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Lancelot Chan
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PostPosted: Sun 12 Aug, 2012 7:15 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Kurt Scholz wrote:
:thumbs up: interesting, btw. How is the concept of mensur - distance control - accounted for in kendo or do they generally have less emphasis on refined stealth footwork?


I think they have fine control on distance too. There isn't any swordsmanship that does not involve distance control.

Ancient Combat Association http://www.acahk.org
Realistic Sparring Weapons http://www.rsw.com.hk
Nightstalkers http://www.nightstalkers.com.hk
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Jean Thibodeau




PostPosted: Sun 12 Aug, 2012 7:53 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Lancelot Chan wrote:
Kurt Scholz wrote:
:thumbs up: interesting, btw. How is the concept of mensur - distance control - accounted for in kendo or do they generally have less emphasis on refined stealth footwork?


I think they have fine control on distance too. There isn't any swordsmanship that does not involve distance control.


Just a pet theory of mine, but I think that people get seduced by specific tricks and techniques, that may be very good and effective, but most have a tendency to forget core basic principles and not apply them tactically or strategically as they should.

Techniques only works well when the basics are observed: One can get away with knowing only a small number of basic guards and attacks but if one keeps up front measure, timing and judgement one can win over someone who knows numerous techniques but neglects the basics.

There is also, reading the opponent and experience helps the really good swordsman with a sixth sense of what the opponent will do even before the opponent knows what he will do.

What is difficult is keeping even the small number of basic fencing principle as the top priorities in the fight and not get distracted by the details of technique.

You can easily give up your freedom. You have to fight hard to get it back!
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