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Richard B. Price




Location: Providence, RI
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PostPosted: Fri 10 Aug, 2012 5:01 pm    Post subject: Olympics sports         Reply with quote

Hi all, let me start off by saying that I have relatively little interest in the Olympics as a whole, I like watching fencing and archery when I remember and can find it, the rest I have little use for. It did occur to me the other day, that jousting should be an Olympic sport, like some of you I'm sure, I watched the couple of jousting shows on cable this past year and was mesmerized. I can do without the drama and bs that goes on between matches, but the sheer talent and concentration it takes to ride, to maneuver a lance, wear the armor and have the state of mind to hit an opponent must be incredible. To anyone's knowledge, has jousting ever been considered for the Olympics, and if not how do we get approved?
Not to take away from any gold medalists out there, I'm sure you've trained hard, but Ping-Pong and what looks to be race ambling (I really am unsure what to call that) are hardly sport. Just trying to make a case for these guys who dedicate their lives and limbs to the joust should have a chance in the world arena. Anyone agree?


Richard

"We shall never know lasting peace until the last king has been strangled with the entrails of the last priest."
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Jared Smith




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PostPosted: Fri 10 Aug, 2012 5:45 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

I would really enjoy seeing Olympic jousting! I have doubts that it will ever happen though. In a "moderately safe" context, and with some semblance of historical lineage, opponents would need some form of protective armor. I would argue that armored fully impact jousting to unseat the opponent as a popularly viewed sport for prizes was fairly concentrated at around 1150 AD to 1275 AD, with increasingly infrequent or eccentric celebrations of it continuing into the 1700's. I think it would be difficult to sell as an international sport having either: ancient Olympic theme, or contemporary popularity as a sport today. (This forum would be an obvious exception.)

I did appreciate the Dressage events that were broadcast a least a couple of times that I got to see this past Olympics. Now if we could just get some increased coverage of the Olympic sport fencing.

Absence of evidence is not necessarily evidence of absence!
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Sander Marechal




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PostPosted: Sat 11 Aug, 2012 2:18 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Jared Smith wrote:
Now if we could just get some increased coverage of the Olympic sport fencing.


I'm not a big fan of fencing. The whole "I hit you a millisecond before you hit me" just isn't my thing. IMHO it's not a martial art. But I'd love to see longsword fighting accepted as a true sport. Possibly with a more referee-like system like judo has.

The Knights Hospitaller: http://www.hospitaalridders.nl
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Richard B. Price




Location: Providence, RI
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PostPosted: Sat 11 Aug, 2012 8:22 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

I agree Sander. fencing seems a little too rigid in its ruling, nothing like historic swordplay at all, but in a severely regulated international sports arena, it's the best they can do for now I suppose. As far as longsword fencing, I'd love to watch that. As a collector and martial artist myself, the long sword is my preferred weapon.
"We shall never know lasting peace until the last king has been strangled with the entrails of the last priest."
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Patrick Kelly




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PostPosted: Sun 12 Aug, 2012 2:27 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Modern fencing is a sport and makes no pretence at being anything else. Criticizing it for that is just as myopic as claiming ping pong isn't a sport. (running after, catching and throwing a ball is a sport but hitting a small one with a paddle isn't ? Come on.) I was a serious sabre fencer for fifteen years long ago and was considered an Olympic hopeful. The only criticism I can make of the sport is the complete and utter lack of form I see in modern electric fencing.

The problem with including jousting would be the modernization of the equipment and the resulting gamesmanship that would follow, just like most modern sports. Modern Olympic jousting would bear no more resemblance to period jousting than Olympic archery does to its traditional fore runner.

"In valor there is hope.".................. Tacitus
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Vincent Le Chevalier




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PostPosted: Sun 12 Aug, 2012 5:48 am    Post subject: Re: Olympics sports         Reply with quote

Richard B. Price wrote:
has jousting ever been considered for the Olympics, and if not how do we get approved?
Not to take away from any gold medalists out there, I'm sure you've trained hard, but Ping-Pong and what looks to be race ambling (I really am unsure what to call that) are hardly sport.

I don't know how a sport gets to be approved exactly, but I'm pretty sure disparaging other sports like that does not help.

But since I don't actually want to see historical martial arts turned into competition sports, I guess I shouldn't care Razz

Regards,

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Richard B. Price




Location: Providence, RI
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PostPosted: Sun 12 Aug, 2012 7:20 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Like I had said before, I don't mean to detract from those who spend many long years developing their skill, but I do wonder what the ancient Greeks would think of our modern Olympic sports. I should think that jousting would seem less out of place than the aforementioned ping-pong, or race walking (I had to look that one up).
"We shall never know lasting peace until the last king has been strangled with the entrails of the last priest."
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Vincent Le Chevalier




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PostPosted: Sun 12 Aug, 2012 10:03 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Most probably the ancient Greeks would disagree with quite a few things, letting women compete and watch for starters, not honouring the gods, non-Greek speaking athletes, etc. You wish to fix those "problems" too?

What's your definition of an "appropriate" sport? What do you find in fencing or archery that ping-pong lacks?

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Vincent
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Julian Reynolds




Location: United Kingdom
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PostPosted: Sun 12 Aug, 2012 10:40 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Bring back Olympic pistol duelling:


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Olympic Duellists 1908.jpg


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Olympic Pistols.jpg

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Michael Curl




Location: Northern California, US
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PostPosted: Sun 12 Aug, 2012 2:23 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

There are jousting sports which don't involve, armor, riding at rings, tent pegging, etc.
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Rod Walker




Location: NSW, Australia.
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PostPosted: Sun 12 Aug, 2012 7:34 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Michael Curl wrote:
There are jousting sports which don't involve, armor, riding at rings, tent pegging, etc.


Those are mounted sports, not jousting sports. Jousting is jousting, two armoured riders hitting each other with lances.

Cheers

Rod
Jouster
www.jousting.com.au

"Come! Let us lay a lance in rest,
And tilt at windmills under a wild sky!
For who would live so petty and unblessed
That dare not tilt at something, ere he die?"
--Errantry, John Galsworthy
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William P




Location: Sydney, Australia
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PostPosted: Mon 13 Aug, 2012 12:28 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Michael Curl wrote:
There are jousting sports which don't involve, armor, riding at rings, tent pegging, etc.


singlestick used to be an olympic sport as well (going off the top of my head, singlestick is a form of semi fencing based off highland broadsword)

i think that other medieval tournement sports might have a place, such as running the quintain for example,
theres also one event seen a faires alo, which involves the lancer trying to passs the lance hrough a series of raings and hus catch as many rings in one pass http://www.mdhorse.org/joust/info.html i dont know what its actually called.

also remember hat in the victorian era there was a revival of medieval jousting ad a spectator sport not unlike whats happening now with he shows full metal jousting.

other sports im sure a no insignificant number of people want to go olympic,
..kendo
MMA is a good candidate with a very good historical precedent "

one could argue for cricket to be an olympic sport, or rugby. both are quite widely practiced.
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Ryan S.





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PostPosted: Mon 13 Aug, 2012 1:35 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

jousting is not widely practiced. rugby will be in the olympics next games. I believe it needs to be practiced in over 75 countries to be considered. I think also, that games like cricket don't need to be in the olympics as there are already major international competitions.
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Jon Wolfe




Location: Orlando, FL
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PostPosted: Tue 14 Aug, 2012 12:44 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Ryan S. wrote:
jousting is not widely practiced. rugby will be in the olympics next games. I believe it needs to be practiced in over 75 countries to be considered. I think also, that games like cricket don't need to be in the olympics as there are already major international competitions.


What about soccer then?
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Jean-Carle Hudon




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PostPosted: Tue 14 Aug, 2012 2:05 pm    Post subject: soccer ?         Reply with quote

Soccer is the number one team sport in the world. Not a big fan myself, but I believe that in terms of sheer numbers, more people play, and watch, soccer than any other sport in the world. Excluding soccer would mean that all team sports would have to fall by the wayside. The problem with cricket is that it is extremely limited in terms of participation, both in total numbers and in the number of countries where criket has any relevance. A bit like American, or Canadian, football, which I personally both enjoy. On the subject of fencing, there was a strong opposition to its' continued presence in the Olympic Games back in the eighties, but we seem to have overcome that hurdle for the time being.
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David Sutton




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PostPosted: Wed 15 Aug, 2012 1:28 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Ryan S. wrote:
jousting is not widely practiced. rugby will be in the olympics next games. I believe it needs to be practiced in over 75 countries to be considered. I think also, that games like cricket don't need to be in the olympics as there are already major international competitions.


I think you'll find that pretty much every sport in the Olympics has major international competitions.

Jean-Carle Hudon wrote:
The problem with cricket is that it is extremely limited in terms of participation, both in total numbers and in the number of countries where criket has any relevance


Cricket is an obsession in the nations of the Indian subcontinent, probably more there than anywhere else. The region is home to around 1.7 billion people and while I'm not arguing that they are all cricket fans, it a pretty large potential fanbase to draw from. Add to that the West Indies, Australia and the South Pacific, Southern Africa; I'd wager that cricket has relevance to a far greater proportion of the earth's population than many of the team sports which have been in the olympics for decades; basketball, volleyball, hockey, handball etc. In fact I think it may actually be the second most popular sport in the world after football (soccer). Personally I think its strange that its featured in the Olympics only once (1900(?)), given the faster, more streamlined variants of the game which have emerged over the last few decades.

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Michael Curl




Location: Northern California, US
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PostPosted: Wed 15 Aug, 2012 1:59 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Jousting is an official sport of maryland according to this, and I doubt it is done while armored.

http://www.msa.md.gov/msa/mdmanual/01glance/h...sport.html

E Pluribus Unum
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Rod Walker




Location: NSW, Australia.
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PostPosted: Wed 15 Aug, 2012 5:01 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Michael Curl wrote:
Jousting is an official sport of maryland according to this, and I doubt it is done while armored.

http://www.msa.md.gov/msa/mdmanual/01glance/h...sport.html


As much as they like to call that jousting, it is not. That is running at the rings.

Cheers

Rod
Jouster
www.jousting.com.au

"Come! Let us lay a lance in rest,
And tilt at windmills under a wild sky!
For who would live so petty and unblessed
That dare not tilt at something, ere he die?"
--Errantry, John Galsworthy
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William P




Location: Sydney, Australia
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PostPosted: Wed 15 Aug, 2012 11:48 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Rod Walker wrote:
Michael Curl wrote:
Jousting is an official sport of maryland according to this, and I doubt it is done while armored.

http://www.msa.md.gov/msa/mdmanual/01glance/h...sport.html


As much as they like to call that jousting, it is not. That is running at the rings.


is that what its properly called? i knew that it was anevent, skewering rings on your lance, but i was never sure of its name..
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Mark Gates




Location: United Kingdom
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PostPosted: Sat 18 Aug, 2012 2:43 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Quote:
Cricket is an obsession... In fact I think it may actually be the second most popular sport in the world after football (soccer). Personally I think its strange that its featured in the Olympics only once (1900(?)), given the faster, more streamlined variants of the game which have emerged over the last few decades.


In the UK, Sport England is currently funding Cricket to the sum of 38,003,357 and Rugby Union/League a combined sum of 60,627,345. Athletics, the anchor sport of the Olympic games, gets just over 20 million. Here in the UK we seem to promote sports that arnt in the Olympics (yet) and under promote the most premier sports.

By the way the quoted figures are based over a 4 year funding period 2009 to 2013.
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