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Jonathan Hopkins




PostPosted: Fri 13 Jan, 2012 7:54 pm    Post subject: Show Us Your Bayonets!         Reply with quote

In the spirit of the other "Show Us..!" threads, please show us your bayonets! Happy

Bayonets are probably one of the most accessible forms of antiques arms, both due to the large numbers made and the relatively low costs for the common models. I am sure that a number of members here have owned a bayonet at some point, even if they did not end up studying them in-depth. I have picked up a few bayonets over the years. I am a fan of the brass gripped models from the middle of the 19th century, and would like to acquire a French M1842 and one of the British yataghan patterns and P1888 at some point.

I'll start off with my most rare bayonet, an Italian Napolean Bersaglieri bayonet (per Calamandrei) marked with the year 1851. Brass grip, iron cross guard, yataghan blade. I have been told that the unit markings on the blade are reminiscent of those seen on Danish or Norwegian weapons. Apparently only 6000 were made and I have only ever seen one other on the market (not that I watch the bayonet market closely). This bayonet is similar to, and easily confused with, the French M1842 sabre bayonet.





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Glen A Cleeton




Location: Nipmuc USA
Joined: 21 Aug 2003

Posts: 1,803

PostPosted: Fri 13 Jan, 2012 11:11 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

I like your collection of yataghans. Was this one a recent buy? I'm afraid my taste for bayonets runs to the more expensive and I have been bad with other inexpensive old stuff. I truly do want an 1870 straight Ames rolling block sword bayonet.

A US 1861 Dahlgren Navy Bayonet would be neat to find in a trunk somewhere or unknown and unloved on a shop shelf somewhere.. An Ames sapper as well, not so easy as picking four leaf clovers.

Cheers

GC



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Jimi Edmonds




Location: Dunedin, New Zealand
Joined: 25 May 2009
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PostPosted: Sat 14 Jan, 2012 12:15 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

1907 sword bayonet, re-issued 1943 for New Zealand Commonwealth forces, used with the Lee Enfield .303 Number 1 Mark 3 SMLE (Short Magazine Lee Enfield) rifle. This rifle was used throughout WW1 and WW2, even being used during Korea, although by the late WW2 MK3 rifles were replaced by the MK4.

Short bayonet Lee Metford pattern 1888, issued or produced 08/1896 for NZ or Australian troops, I think these were used with the Long Tom rifle.. Unfortuniatly this bayonet has had the butt removed so proberly used as a pig sticker at some point.

I had a real nice early WW2 Italian bayonet with scabbard but some dick stole it!



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Lin Robinson




Location: NC
Joined: 15 Jun 2006
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PostPosted: Sat 14 Jan, 2012 4:44 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Here is my antique Brown Bess bayonet, laid out on the King's Colours. It is marked with the maker's name - John Gill. Gill made bayonets in the latter part of the 18th c. so this one was probably for the India Pattern musket.


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Lin Robinson

"The best thing in life is to crush your enemies, see them driven before you and hear the lamentation of their women." Conan the Barbarian, 1982
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Jonathan Hopkins




PostPosted: Sat 14 Jan, 2012 9:51 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Glen,
It is not new (nothing new in a year). I got it when I was 15. Happy The bayonets you have shared are quite nice and very worthy of your American edged weapon collection. Aside from being more expensive, are they generally easy to find on the market?

Jim,
Thank you for sharing your bayonets! I like the 1907 and I have an example of the Indian Army version (1907 India pattern No.1 Mk.2* bayonet made in July 1943.):







Last edited by Jonathan Hopkins on Sat 14 Jan, 2012 10:10 am; edited 1 time in total
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Jonathan Hopkins




PostPosted: Sat 14 Jan, 2012 9:57 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Lin,
That is a great bayonet! I used to have one, too, although I think mine was early 19th century. IIRC, the are quite light and I don't think they would have been much of an encumbrance.

Jonathan
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Jonathan Hopkins




PostPosted: Sat 14 Jan, 2012 10:14 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Here is another one I've had for ages--

Made in Germany by Schnitzler & Kirschbaum (S&K) to fit a minie rifle that was being made in Liege for Brazil. They were redirected to the U.S. during the American Civil War. This bayonet could be for the U.S. or for Brazil. Often misidentified as Sea Service Enfields.





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Glen A Cleeton




Location: Nipmuc USA
Joined: 21 Aug 2003

Posts: 1,803

PostPosted: Sat 14 Jan, 2012 12:02 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Hi Jonathan

The Dahlgrens are a really high pricey collector piece I will probably never own. The 1870s are around from time to time but there ar reproductions of those as well to be careful of. A lot of the 1870 blades turn up in artillery sword handles and get labeled as something else. Not uncommon is to see the all brass bullseye artillery handle on an 1870 blade. IMA was selling reproduction 1870 and artillery sword handles and I had thought to maybe make up an 1870 compilation. The crisp 1870s with a scabbard still circulate at a price I might consider but they are getting fewer and far apart with each generation of ownership wantoing another $50 or so.

The nice Plymouth 1961 from Collins that was posted about elsewhere is/was a good buy if I am correct about the source. That is one of the civil war yataghans. bayonets ae not really my thing but I tend to see some specific examples making the rounds from dealer to dealer and then to collectors. What to do? I do kow where there is one 1870 in a hidey hole but without scabbard and a bit ragged for the price. Problem there is that there are other interesting blades further up the list.

Cheers

GC
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Daniel Wallace




Location: Pennsylvania USA
Joined: 07 Aug 2011

Posts: 580

PostPosted: Sat 14 Jan, 2012 12:55 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

for anyone looking to research a particular bayonet i found this little site a little while back, the information looks pretty sound but i'm not an expert in the field, but it does look like it could help anyone looking to identify a specific bayonet

http://worldbayonets.com/
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Jonathan Hopkins




PostPosted: Sat 14 Jan, 2012 1:47 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Thanks for posting the link. Happy Two other useful sites are:

www.old-smithy.info

www.oldbayos.com
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Jonathan Hopkins




PostPosted: Sun 15 Jan, 2012 7:03 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

It is my understanding that sword bayonets were generally issued to elite/specialist troops (e.g. riflemen, pioneers, etc.). This changed when the French introduced the Mle. 1866 Chassepot bayonet as it was issued to all infantry and not just elite units. Many European nations soon followed suit. Today it is one of the most common 19th century bayonets on the market. Some collectors have challenged themselves to collect examples made by each manufactory, as well as those issued to colonial troops (indicated by an anchor stamp on the guard). Below is my Mle. 1866 Chassepot bayonet made at St. Etienne in 1873 (St. Etienne-made bayonets are the most common):









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Lin Robinson




Location: NC
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PostPosted: Sun 15 Jan, 2012 7:24 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Jonathan Hopkins wrote:
Lin,
That is a great bayonet! I used to have one, too, although I think mine was early 19th century. IIRC, the are quite light and I don't think they would have been much of an encumbrance.

Jonathan


Thank you Jonathan...

I bought it 28 years ago from a fellow who was in an historical organization with me. He wanted "$40 and not a penny less". We cut a deal on the spot. I have carried it in reenactments, affixed to my Pedersoli Brown Bess and in a double frog with a tomahawk. Probably should not have done that but it was fun.

Lin

Lin Robinson

"The best thing in life is to crush your enemies, see them driven before you and hear the lamentation of their women." Conan the Barbarian, 1982
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Jonathan Hopkins




PostPosted: Sun 15 Jan, 2012 9:37 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

I sold this one a while back, but since only one socket bayonet is represented I thought I would share it. It is a British Pattern 1876 socket bayonet for the Martini Henry rifle. This one is bigger and heavier than the Brown Bess bayonet-- I regret selling it!



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Jonathan Hopkins




PostPosted: Mon 16 Jan, 2012 2:08 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Here is the last of my sword bayonets, a humble French M1874 epee bayonet for the Gras rifle. This model is also quite plentiful and can be found quite cheaply. As with the M1866 Chassepot bayonets, some collectors attempt to collect examples from each manufactory as well as those made for colonial service. The serial numbers on the guard and scabbard match, and the spine bears the date 1877.











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Jonathan Hopkins




PostPosted: Tue 17 Jan, 2012 9:11 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Below is an old photo of my bayonets that may convey some sense of size and scale. I have since sold the Brown Bess bayonet, the P1876 socket bayonet, and the M1874 Gras bayonet with no scabbard. At the time this photo was taken I had no yet purchased the M1866 Chassepot bayonet.

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David Wilson




Location: In a van down by the river
Joined: 23 Aug 2003

Posts: 770

PostPosted: Tue 17 Jan, 2012 2:22 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Here are some.... in no particular order, there are two bayonets for a 98K rifle, both service and dress use; An older German bayonet; A French "Needle" Bayonet; An AKM bayonet (Polish, I believe); And an M91 Moisin-Nagant bayonet.

The first four my father brought home from the Second World War. The other two came with rifles I bought.



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David K. Wilson, Jr.
Laird of Glencoe

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Jonathan Hopkins




PostPosted: Tue 17 Jan, 2012 3:15 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

That is a very nice group, David! Thank you for posting. Happy I bought a French Lebel bayonet (as a gift to a friend who was starting a bayonet collection) that had been cut down like yours. It was hard to part with--the grip felt great and the cross section on that thing is wicked, as is the point. As I may have mentioned before, I am a sucker for those brass/yellow metal grips.
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Josh Marlan




Location: New York
Joined: 01 Mar 2011

Posts: 5

PostPosted: Thu 19 Jan, 2012 4:37 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Civil war era.


















cottontailcustoms.com
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Daniel Wallace




Location: Pennsylvania USA
Joined: 07 Aug 2011

Posts: 580

PostPosted: Sat 21 Jan, 2012 10:42 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

i can't believe i posted a link for reference and forgot to post my one relics

the one on top is a brazilian m 1908. i got it from a guy that bough armorys and rebuilt firearms. his guy had about 500 chinese sks's in his shop and sold me one for 35 bucks. he also had about 400 of these just in a wooden box. i got it for 40 bucks. i actually use it for a work knife. the blade was broken and rewelded and it doesn't have any of the stamp codes so i figured it's not worth too much, but it is a heck of a 'bush' knife. every time i sharpen it up a bit it just eats away at my wet stone. at 16in it gets some attention when your out hunting and the other guys wonder 'what the heck is that for.' but then they see how versatile i make it look and they get it.

the other i don't know too much about i believe it's second WW and was possible it was a training knife. when i picked it up it was also about 40 bucks at a flee market and had looked like someone put it go a grinding wheel.

i've been shocked with how much the prices of bayonets have gone up in value in the past few years. i see a lot of Chassepot sword bayonets every time i go to a gun show, but man they want top dollar for them.



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Ozsváth Árpád-István




Location: Romania
Joined: 27 Apr 2008

Posts: 131

PostPosted: Mon 23 Jan, 2012 8:57 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

David Wilson wrote:
Here are some.... in no particular order, there are two bayonets for a 98K rifle, both service and dress use; An older German bayonet; A French "Needle" Bayonet; An AKM bayonet (Polish, I believe); And an M91 Moisin-Nagant bayonet.


David, the "older German bayonet" is actually an Austro-Hungarian M95 Mannlicher bayonet NCO version used in both world wars. The most common makers were OEWG(Austria) and FGGY(Hungary). You can find the makers mark on the ricasso.
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