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Nick Hallacher





Joined: 12 Aug 2011

Posts: 23

PostPosted: Sun 08 Jan, 2012 5:16 pm    Post subject: Viking scabbard         Reply with quote

Hello,

I have a custom scabbard being made for a tinker viking sword, but it is going to be a long time in the making. Until then I have been trying to dress up the stock scabbard in such a way as to make it more historical. First step was a suspension rig of some kind. I originally tried making a slide bride, but couldn't find a reliable way of attaching it to the scabbard. So I made a baldric (See attached).

Yes the rings and most of the rivets are modern, but since I have one being made I didn't want to waste a lot of time or money on something that is temporary. I still intend to remove the two metal fittings, or atleast finish removing the rings that come on them.

My question is, is there anything I can do that is relatively simple to the baldric or scabbard to make it more historically accurate?


I leave it to the masters.



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Matthew Bunker




Location: Somerset UK
Joined: 02 Apr 2009

Posts: 483

PostPosted: Mon 09 Jan, 2012 12:57 am    Post subject: Re: Viking scabbard         Reply with quote

Nick Hallacher wrote:

My question is, is there anything I can do that is relatively simple to the baldric or scabbard to make it more historically accurate?

.


The easiest thing would be to get rid of the two rings on the straps coming off the scabbard and run those straps straight up to the main ring.
As far as we know (based on surviving examples), Viking baldric systems had only one ring in them as you can see in this picture of a reconstruction based on the Cronk Moar scabbard (the metalwork on the bottom strap is a tongueless buckle).



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"If a Greek can do it, two Englishman certainly can !"
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James Barker




Location: Ashburn VA
Joined: 20 Apr 2005

Posts: 365

PostPosted: Mon 09 Jan, 2012 4:36 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Also get rid of the pop rivets holding the leather together. Matthew's replica uses stitching where the leather overlaps or brass chapes with real rivets in them in places.
James Barker
Historic Life http://www.historiclife.com/index.html
Archer in La Belle Compagnie http://www.labelle.org/
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Nick Hallacher





Joined: 12 Aug 2011

Posts: 23

PostPosted: Mon 09 Jan, 2012 5:51 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Alright, I think I understand but am slightly confused as to the exact setup.


The top part of the baldric where it connects directly to the scabbard, then should the central strap be sewn to that and then to the remaining ring?

I attached an image to try and describe what I am asking



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Matthew Bunker




Location: Somerset UK
Joined: 02 Apr 2009

Posts: 483

PostPosted: Mon 09 Jan, 2012 6:05 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Hi Nick,

Hopefully this pic makes it clearer.

There are three straps in that arrangement.

1. The upper strap
2. The lower strap
3. The buckle strap

1.There's a loop of leather underneath the upper strap on the scabbard. The upper strap is stitched to this in two places. The upper strap starts at the ring, is fixed to the loop on the scabbard and then goes all the way over the dhlulder and back through the buckle, ending with a metal strap end.

2. the lower strap forms a loop around the lower part of the scabbard, goes through the false buckle fixed to it's own end and then runs up to the ring.

3. The buckle strap is very short, starts at the ring and ends with the buckle.

I can email you a bigger picture if you PM me your email address.



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Ken Speed





Joined: 09 Oct 2006

Posts: 656

PostPosted: Mon 09 Jan, 2012 6:13 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

No claims to any great expertise from me but I agree with James, the rivets have to go. It might be easier to replace them with a simple lacing pattern rather than stitching. I can't honestly say that I'm aware of any existing examples from that era of leather work done that way but it'll be much more authentic seeming than pop rivets! Frankly, I think it looks appropriate even if it isn't Big Grin
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Matthew Bunker




Location: Somerset UK
Joined: 02 Apr 2009

Posts: 483

PostPosted: Mon 09 Jan, 2012 7:12 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Ken Speed wrote:
No claims to any great expertise from me but I agree with James, the rivets have to go. It might be easier to replace them with a simple lacing pattern rather than stitching. I can't honestly say that I'm aware of any existing examples from that era of leather work done that way but it'll be much more authentic seeming than pop rivets! Frankly, I think it looks appropriate even if it isn't Big Grin


You mean lacing with thong?
How is that easier than stitching? I know I do a lot of it and have the callouses to prove it but even so, it's pretty simple. Two needles, some thread, some wax and an awl.


Nick, the very simplest thing you could do to make a cheap, temporary suspension system is to put the scabbard onto a single hanging baldrick rather than one with a strap distributor.

Make tight fitting loop for scabbard, stitch baldrick strap to loop, put buckle on one end of strap. Job done. No rivetting, very little stitching.

"If a Greek can do it, two Englishman certainly can !"
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Ken Speed





Joined: 09 Oct 2006

Posts: 656

PostPosted: Mon 09 Jan, 2012 10:15 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Matthew Bunker asked me, "You mean lacing with thong? How is that easier than stitching? ........."

Matt, I'll readily admit the idea of sewing leather gives me the yips, actually I don't much like the idea of sewing anything and avoid it like the plague. Lacing a strap seems much easier to me. We'd use leather boot lace or cut the equivalent, punch holes with a hole punch, and pull the lacing through the holes. We'd use a pliers ,if necessary, to pull the lace through the holes.

It was a fairly common way to fasten reins to bridle bits or to fix a broken strap. Generally we'd punch four holes in an approximate square and thread the lace through in a somewhat decorative X pattern and then leave a couple inches of each end dangling free so it didn't work loose. it was amazingly secure and decorative in a rustic way.

I think someone posted a scabbard here not too long ago where they fastened the buckles to the straps that way and it looked good and somehow appropriate for a Viking age outfit to my eye, at least.

I guess you can take the boy out of the farm but you can't take the farm out of the boy!
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James Barker




Location: Ashburn VA
Joined: 20 Apr 2005

Posts: 365

PostPosted: Tue 10 Jan, 2012 4:47 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

On leather lacing. Lacing with a thong existed in early era finds (not sword finds that I know of) but they did not use a round punch to lace through in any of the finds I have ever seen Roman to middle ages; they always used a simple slit in the leather.
James Barker
Historic Life http://www.historiclife.com/index.html
Archer in La Belle Compagnie http://www.labelle.org/
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