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Tim Lison




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PostPosted: Wed 04 Jan, 2012 10:41 pm    Post subject: In Progress sword by Jeff Helmes!!!         Reply with quote

I contacted Jeff Helmes, after seeing the fantastic job he did on JD Crawford's sword recently, about making a sword for me. Jeff was great about communication, we had some great email volleys about his methods and the prices of his work. I decided on a sword and it was set. Then I changed my mind after seeing pics of a sword I hadn't seen previously. It was a late viking sword, which is my favorite, with a B.1 pommel and a thin style 1 cross. I hadn't seen one like it so I decided to have it made. Jeff and I had talked about doing an iron core with steel edges for the previous sword which I liked the sound of. The new sword I decided to have made also has INGELRII inlay. Jeff said we could do both the iron core and inlay which sounds too cool to me! So, it was decided! Here are pictures of the original:


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Tim Lison




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PostPosted: Wed 04 Jan, 2012 10:46 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Jeff sent the first 2 pictures of this sword. The first shot is of the billet ready for forging. The second is after the forging. The look of the iron center is markedly different than that of the steel edges! I'm really looking forward to seeing this one cleaned up as I think it will be stunning!


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Jeremy V. Krause




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PostPosted: Thu 05 Jan, 2012 6:45 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

I'm SUPER excited!! Eek!

This looks like a perfect design and right up my alley. I have never seen this specimen or if I did then it didn't stick for some reason. I'm really looking forward to seeing this. . . . .

Did I say that I am excited, oh, wait I did.
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Luka Borscak




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PostPosted: Thu 05 Jan, 2012 8:02 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

What are the dimensions of this one?
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Tim Lison




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PostPosted: Thu 05 Jan, 2012 9:10 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Luka Borscak wrote:
What are the dimensions of this one?


The total length is 99cm.
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Tim Lison




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PostPosted: Thu 05 Jan, 2012 9:15 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Jeremy V. Krause wrote:
I'm SUPER excited!! Eek!

This looks like a perfect design and right up my alley. I have never seen this specimen or if I did then it didn't stick for some reason. I'm really looking forward to seeing this. . . . .

Did I say that I am excited, oh, wait I did.


Thanks Jeremy! I didn't see this sword until recently. It was posted in this thread:

http://www.myArmoury.com/talk/viewtopic.php?t=24947

I saw it and knew I had to have it. It's right up my alley too! I think you know that we have fairly similar tastes... There seem to be a few of us that really like swords from the late viking/ early medieval era; you, me, JD, Luka... I'm sure we all have swords that the others would love!!!
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Jeremy V. Krause




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PostPosted: Thu 05 Jan, 2012 9:48 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

The fuller edges look a bit "soft" to me. What are your opinions on this?

I like to see swords made with more soft fuller edges from time to time if it is consistent with the original.

Or are you thinking that this would be due to corrosion than the original shaping?

Is that an inron/steel inlay or silver? I believe INGELRII were iron but. . . . .
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Tim Lison




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PostPosted: Thu 05 Jan, 2012 10:49 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Jeremy V. Krause wrote:
The fuller edges look a bit "soft" to me. What are your opinions on this?

I like to see swords made with more soft fuller edges from time to time if it is consistent with the original.

Or are you thinking that this would be due to corrosion than the original shaping?

Is that an inron/steel inlay or silver? I believe INGELRII were iron but. . . . .


I think the softness of the fuller edges might have to do with how this sword was cleaned. It looks to have been subjected to some pretty harsh methods which may have softened it up a bit. The inlay will be pattern welded rod.
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Luka Borscak




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PostPosted: Thu 05 Jan, 2012 2:17 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Tim Lison wrote:
Jeremy V. Krause wrote:
I'm SUPER excited!! Eek!

This looks like a perfect design and right up my alley. I have never seen this specimen or if I did then it didn't stick for some reason. I'm really looking forward to seeing this. . . . .

Did I say that I am excited, oh, wait I did.


Thanks Jeremy! I didn't see this sword until recently. It was posted in this thread:

http://www.myArmoury.com/talk/viewtopic.php?t=24947

I saw it and knew I had to have it. It's right up my alley too! I think you know that we have fairly similar tastes... There seem to be a few of us that really like swords from the late viking/ early medieval era; you, me, JD, Luka... I'm sure we all have swords that the others would love!!!


Happy Yes, there are a few of us here with similar tastes in late viking / early middleages period... When I saw this sword I immediately thought that I might use it as an inspiration for a next hilt I'm going to get made and put on one of my swords expecting a customization soon. Wink
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Paul Hansen




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PostPosted: Thu 05 Jan, 2012 2:27 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Great choice Tim! Looking forward to seeing more! Cool

Regarding the roundness of the fuller edges, it is something I've seen before on similar swords. It could be due to cleaning / "restauration", but on the other hand the production process was different from what we are used to nowadays (CNC...) and it makes sense that on originals the fullers are not so crisp and well defined as what we are used to in the higher quality reproductions. Uneven and wavy fullers are another example of this.
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Luka Borscak




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PostPosted: Thu 05 Jan, 2012 2:34 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Looking at this and a few other swords I like I realized I'm missing much with leaving out the inscriptions on blades I get customized. I have to change that. I'm not sure with what money though... Wink
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Jeremy V. Krause




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PostPosted: Thu 05 Jan, 2012 7:12 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Just a thought Tim,

It might be interesting to take a look at other INGELRII swords to determine the shape and definition of fullers on those examples. Maybe you could, sort of, "cross-check" regarding the sharper fuller edges you are looking at executing with this one. Of course, determining if said INGELRII sword was from the same wokshop as the piece in question would be impossible, but it may inform your choice, or possibly challenge it, if you see more examples with either hard/distinct or soft edges that haven't been so aggresively treated as this one.

I certainly don't have a dog in this fight- and I'm not challenging your opinion here. I have just began thinking a bit more about fuller definition in period and wondering about how much variety could have been seen at the time.
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Ryan Renfro




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PostPosted: Thu 05 Jan, 2012 8:47 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Great choice of swords, Tim. Iím eager to see how this one turns out.

Records X. 9, which has a similar hilt but a somewhat different blade profile, has an even less well-defined fuller. The fuller widens noticeably at the INGELRII inscription. I have no idea what cleaning preceded Oakeshottís lemon juice, vinegar, and Worcester Sauce bath, but the rounded lines of the fuller are a striking contrast to the sharp lines of the cross and pommel. I would have difficulty believing that, at least on the Glasgow sword, the soft edges are not original.



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Tim Lison




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PostPosted: Thu 05 Jan, 2012 9:18 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

I think the crisp fullers look better, especially with inlay. There's a case to be made for either side.

Last edited by Tim Lison on Thu 05 Jan, 2012 9:28 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Tim Lison




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PostPosted: Thu 05 Jan, 2012 9:27 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Luka Borscak wrote:
Looking at this and a few other swords I like I realized I'm missing much with leaving out the inscriptions on blades I get customized. I have to change that. I'm not sure with what money though... Wink


Inlay does add a lot and is very period appropriate! A little silver inlay, a little iron inlay, maybe some gold? There was a DIY project that someone did a few years ago on here about using gold pen for inlay that I can't find now that would be a less expensive option...
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Tim Lison




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PostPosted: Thu 05 Jan, 2012 9:30 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

New batch of photos! Jeff sent these today. Man, he is fast!!! The first is the blade, the second the beginning of the inlay! Looks great!


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J.D. Crawford




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PostPosted: Fri 06 Jan, 2012 1:23 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Looking great so far Tim! A beautiful original + a very talented craftsman should = an outstanding sword!

I know how you're feeling about Jeff's speedy work, its like 'is this actually happening?'. I suspect that in a few years he'll have a big line-up so its great to get on board early with him and have this experience. I'm also pleased that I could help nudge you on this particular project, after all the influence your collection has had on my own collecting habits.

PS, my alter Ego, Prof. Moriarty says: Curses Holmes! Just when I thought I had the better of you with my Korsoygaden sword, you foil my evil plans again with this Ingelrii. But you haven't seen the last of me Holmes. (...evil laugh). Happy
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Jeremy V. Krause




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PostPosted: Fri 06 Jan, 2012 2:07 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Looking great tim! This was such a great choice to have reproduced.
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Tim Lison




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PostPosted: Fri 06 Jan, 2012 8:53 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

J.D. Crawford wrote:
PS, my alter Ego, Prof. Moriarty says: Curses Holmes! Just when I thought I had the better of you with my Korsoygaden sword, you foil my evil plans again with this Ingelrii. But you haven't seen the last of me Holmes. (...evil laugh). Happy


Well, Moriarty, your Korsoygaden sword was an unexpected twist and almost had the better of me...but I always land on my feet! Bring on your next project...
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Tim Lison




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PostPosted: Fri 06 Jan, 2012 8:57 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Jeff is kinda like "the Flash" of swords. Here is the latest batch of photos...


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