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Brett White




Location: Brisbane Australia
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PostPosted: Sat 19 Nov, 2011 4:28 pm    Post subject: Arms and Armor 12th Century Sword.         Reply with quote

Just wondering if anybody on here has handled it? I am tossing up either that sword or another and I'd like some opinions.
"My sword has deus vault engraved on the blade, his has sharp end toward enemy." -Ash a secret history.
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Joshua Anthony




Location: The Redneck Riviera
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PostPosted: Sat 19 Nov, 2011 4:33 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Oddly enough, I just bought that sword! It's supposed to arrive on Wednesday the 23rd. I'll write up a quick post with pics when I have it. I was surprised when I was doing my research that there were not more extensive reviews available on-line, especially here.

Does anyone know how long this sword has been out?

I assume you have looked at the pics available over on Kult of Athena?

"...He that hath no sword, let him sell his garment and buy one." - Jesus, Luke 22:36
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J.D. Crawford




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PostPosted: Sat 19 Nov, 2011 4:49 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

There's a short review here: http://www.tritonworks.com/reviews?content=re...=aaa_12thC

But I would also like to see more photos and a more detailed review.
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William Swiger




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PostPosted: Sun 20 Nov, 2011 1:32 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

I ordered one a couple of years ago from Craig at A&A. I had the blade changed to 36 inches and the grip to 7 inches. Also had an engraving on the pommel. Very nice sword and handles well.


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Tim Mathews




Location: St Paul MN
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PostPosted: Sun 20 Nov, 2011 4:22 am    Post subject: Ams and Armor 12 century sword I         Reply with quote

Good morning ,
I have the great good fortune of being a long time friend and patron of the shop and have handled most of the production pieces and quite a few of the custom pieces before they went out the door ... This sword is without question my favorite production piece ... The specs are listed on the site but what the technical information fails to do is convey how that sword - for all its size - comes alive in your hand ...
It is definitely one of the best pieces in my collection

Tim Mathews
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Joshua Anthony




Location: The Redneck Riviera
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PostPosted: Mon 21 Nov, 2011 6:55 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

William Swiger wrote:
I ordered one a couple of years ago from Craig at A&A. I had the blade changed to 36 inches and the grip to 7 inches. Also had an engraving on the pommel. Very nice sword and handles well.


Very nice collection William! How would you say the A&A compares to your other swords (Albions?) in terms of quality, handling, etc?

"...He that hath no sword, let him sell his garment and buy one." - Jesus, Luke 22:36
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William Swiger




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PostPosted: Mon 21 Nov, 2011 10:27 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Joshua Anthony wrote:
William Swiger wrote:
I ordered one a couple of years ago from Craig at A&A. I had the blade changed to 36 inches and the grip to 7 inches. Also had an engraving on the pommel. Very nice sword and handles well.


Very nice collection William! How would you say the A&A compares to your other swords (Albions?) in terms of quality, handling, etc?


This A&A compares very well to the Albions. The only Albion longsword I have is the Duke and my choice between it and the 12th Century comes out in favor of the 12th Century. It just feels better in hand. The 12th Century has a more powerful feeling.
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William Swiger




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PostPosted: Mon 21 Nov, 2011 10:32 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Forgot to add that I also have the Albion Museum Line Brescia Spadona but did not use it to compare because it is in another price range than the Albion Duke and A&A 12th Century.
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Joshua Anthony




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PostPosted: Thu 24 Nov, 2011 6:08 am    Post subject: Re: Arms and Armor 12th Century Sword.         Reply with quote

Brett White wrote:
Just wondering if anybody on here has handled it? I am tossing up either that sword or another and I'd like some opinions.


Hey Brett, I received my A&A 12th Century Sword yesterday, and thought I would post a quick pic of the sword in hand to give you a size reference:



All the other pics I've looked at were of the sword alone, so I thought it might help.

As for the sword itself I can tell you it feels very solid in the hand. I like the grip circumference, it feels just a little larger than, say, the Albions I've handled. As far as quality goes I'd say it's right up there with Albion, but at a lower price point. It has more of a "hand made" vibe and look to it, while I'd describe the Albions as almost "too perfect." (which makes sense because A&A's are hand forged one at a time, while Albion blades are made using CNC machines.)

You never said, what other sword are you looking at?

"...He that hath no sword, let him sell his garment and buy one." - Jesus, Luke 22:36
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Chad Arnow
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PostPosted: Thu 24 Nov, 2011 6:24 am    Post subject: Re: Arms and Armor 12th Century Sword.         Reply with quote

Joshua Anthony wrote:
It has more of a "hand made" vibe and look to it, while I'd describe the Albions as almost "too perfect." (which makes sense because A&A's are hand forged one at a time, while Albion blades are made using CNC machines.)


It's worth noting that A&A typically doesn't forge its production sword blades as far as I know. They are ground from pre-cut blade blanks (I saw stacks of them when I was in their shop). Albion uses a CNC machine to do a good portion of their grinding, then they finish by hand. A&A grinds them with hand power tools the entire way as far as I know.

They do forge some of their smaller blades and other things, but their production swords are indeed ground, just not by CNC machine. This will result in more individuality of the finished item and fits with their aesthetic goals.

Happy

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Joshua Anthony




Location: The Redneck Riviera
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PostPosted: Thu 24 Nov, 2011 6:32 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Ah, okay, thanks. I'm fairly new to collecting swords and the terminology, so when A&A states on their website "At Arms & Armor, we provide quality and service you cannot find elsewhere. Our method—individually hand-crafting reproductions of the highest caliber..." I took that to mean forged by hand.

Also, Kult of Athena (where I bought the sword) states on their website: "each piece is hand forged one at a time."

So I guess that's where I get confused. I like the individuality in the A&A blades by the way, it wasn't a knock on their methods.

"...He that hath no sword, let him sell his garment and buy one." - Jesus, Luke 22:36


Last edited by Joshua Anthony on Thu 24 Nov, 2011 6:39 am; edited 1 time in total
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Chad Arnow
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PostPosted: Thu 24 Nov, 2011 6:38 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Joshua Anthony wrote:
Ah, okay, thanks. I'm fairly new to collecting swords and the terminology, so when A&A states on their website "At Arms & Armor, we provide quality and service you cannot find elsewhere. Our method—individually hand-crafting reproductions of the highest caliber..." I took that to mean forged by hand.

Thanks for the correction.


Hand-crafting can mean hand-grinding. Happy For me, forging vs. grinding is no big deal. We're already dealing with steels and quality of heat treat that are different (much better on average) than what was available in period. Grinding was used in period as well, so having things ground by machine or by electricity-powered hand tool isn't an issue for me. Paying someone to grind using period-correct techniques like water- or mule-driven wheels gets costly after all. Happy

Happy

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Joshua Anthony




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PostPosted: Thu 24 Nov, 2011 6:45 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Ha! Getting black lung disease whilst slaving over a hot forge might be period correct too, but less than optimal:-)
"...He that hath no sword, let him sell his garment and buy one." - Jesus, Luke 22:36
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Jean Thibodeau




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PostPosted: Thu 24 Nov, 2011 8:01 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Chad Arnow wrote:

Hand-crafting can mean hand-grinding. Happy For me, forging vs. grinding is no big deal. We're already dealing with steels and quality of heat treat that are different (much better on average) than what was available in period. Grinding was used in period as well, so having things ground by machine or by electricity-powered hand tool isn't an issue for me. Paying someone to grind using period-correct techniques like water- or mule-driven wheels gets costly after all. Happy


Chad: I agree that with good steel and good heat treat forging doesn't produce a better blade but can be more versatile making more complex cross sections where radiuses can be variable or progressive rather than defined by the diameters of the grinding wheels: Case in point the very flat and wide fullers on my Cinquedea made by Michael Pikula that also has a thick and prominent central ridge, one could do this with just grinding but it would be more difficult than forging.

Well there is also pattern welding/Damascus that has period and aesthetic advantages or differences.

Oh, to get back specifically to A&A they can and do forge some custom pieces for the reasons mentioned above and also make custom modifications to their standard models: I am waiting for an English Bill head that the only customization is that the piece is heat treated to give it more strength and mostly sharper edges. ( Actually the tracking is saying OUT FOR DELIVERY Happy and I'm expecting it any moment now ).

Oh, and Joshua I really appreciate the pic showing it in hand and this really is making me think about getting it eventually after I give my bank account and credit card some cooling off time. Wink I already like it but now I'm really interested. Big Grin Cool

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Joshua Anthony




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PostPosted: Thu 24 Nov, 2011 8:15 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Jean Thibodeau wrote:

Oh, and Joshua I really appreciate the pic showing it in hand and this really is making me think about getting it eventually after I give my bank account and credit card some cooling off time. Wink I already like it but now I'm really interested. Big Grin Cool


Yeah, I know what you mean Jean. I'm beginning to suspect that the term "shopaholic" might have some validity in my case.... Blush

I'm thinking I'll have the handle rewrapped in brown, but after that I'm checking myself into a rehab clinic for armor addicts....

"...He that hath no sword, let him sell his garment and buy one." - Jesus, Luke 22:36
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J.D. Crawford




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PostPosted: Thu 24 Nov, 2011 8:26 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

I really like this sword. At first glance it looks like just another XIIIa variant with standard fittings, but the detailed geometry and finish on the cross and pommel are terrific. If it also handles great - bonus! I've come close to picking it up as well several times. I think my two A&A custom blades likely came from the same stock.
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Brett White




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PostPosted: Thu 24 Nov, 2011 12:27 pm    Post subject: Re: Arms and Armor 12th Century Sword.         Reply with quote

Hey Brett, I received my A&A 12th Century Sword yesterday, and thought I would post a quick pic of the sword in hand to give you a size reference:

You never said, what other sword are you looking at?[/quote]

Thank you. The sword looks great in hand. It is always hard to tell the proportions from photo's of the sword alone. As for the other sword I was looking at, I was considering giving DSA another chance for a little while but I'd rather not. This was the sword that I should have bought last time but the Dealer that I was going through convinced me to try DSA.

"My sword has deus vault engraved on the blade, his has sharp end toward enemy." -Ash a secret history.
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Russ Ellis
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PostPosted: Mon 28 Nov, 2011 7:55 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

It's an older and shorter review but...

http://www.tritonworks.com/reviews?content=re...=aaa_12thC

TRITONWORKS Custom Scabbards
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J.D. Crawford




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PostPosted: Mon 28 Nov, 2011 12:05 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

And lo and behold, there's one up for sale on the classifieds. I'd be tempted but have another item just about done and I'm somewhere on the waiting list for another A&A project. Can't have everything you want. Happy
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