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Forum Index > Makers and Manufacturers Talk > ATrim peens get a new look. discussion on permanent assembly Reply to topic
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Tom Kinder





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PostPosted: Fri 04 Nov, 2011 5:40 pm    Post subject: ATrim peens get a new look. discussion on permanent assembly         Reply with quote

I would like to discuss the peens and construction of ATrim swords that have been permanently assembled. first I want to give this a little time for people to discuss the results of a new method we are using, then I will start to talk about the method we are using and what we plan to do in the future and what this all means for our customers.

this is how ATrim peens used to look:



this is what they look like now:





your thoughts, and comments welcome
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P. Cha




PostPosted: Fri 04 Nov, 2011 6:12 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Definitely a fan of the new method. Looks less manufactured.
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Colt Reeves





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PostPosted: Fri 04 Nov, 2011 7:22 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

I've a question: What gives the two-piece/layer look for the "old" peen-job? Is it done over a washer or something? (An itty-bitty wee whiddle peen block...)
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Chad Arnow
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PostPosted: Fri 04 Nov, 2011 8:31 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Looks great. Both methods are heads and shoulders above the hex nut assembly, whose look I personally cannot stand.
Happy

ChadA

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Tom Kinder





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PostPosted: Fri 04 Nov, 2011 8:45 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

the old version is all one piece. there is no washer or block.

the difference is actually pretty much invisible because I could do one the old way if I ground it right. what we are using is still basically a nut over the normal ATrim threaded tang. we just use epoxy and compression to make sure it will never come undone. if you think of a hex nut with a solid back instead of a hex hole and a flange then you have the right basic idea. the difference is that the new ones have a thicker flange so that it mates up better to the pommel than the old versions.

occasionally the old version would sink too deep and leave a funny looking result like this one:








this new version fixes that, but I don't want to copy someone else' work so I'm not interested in doing things the old way.
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Joe Fults




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PostPosted: Fri 04 Nov, 2011 10:23 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Looks better to me.
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Bartek Strojek




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PostPosted: Sat 05 Nov, 2011 2:39 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Very nice. Old method definitely stung eyes a lot, compared to very 'handsome' rest of the sword.
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Luka Borscak




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PostPosted: Sat 05 Nov, 2011 6:06 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

So Atrim " peened" swords are not actually peened but threaded nut plus peened end of the nut?
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Tom Kinder





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PostPosted: Sat 05 Nov, 2011 8:09 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Luka Borscak wrote:
So Atrim " peened" swords are not actually peened but threaded nut plus peened end of the nut?

Yup, that's right Luka, though a small amount of hammer peening does occur to help lock it in place and to look nice.

This method is a lot stronger than the traditional hot peen, but we will be offering traditional hot peening fairly soon.
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Johan Gemvik




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PostPosted: Sat 05 Nov, 2011 6:27 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

If this is using a flat non sharp thread type (which the photos indeed seem to me to indicate) that won't create stress concetrations or a starting point for a crack , and if it's using and annealed tang end, then it can indeed be stronger than a traditional peen at the pommel. Though If the gavel is glued to the tang a lot less pull on the pommel is transferred in the first place and a hot peen is not going to come off either though it might need some re-peening if it comes loose after heavy use.

It's also worth noting that there are some historical fencing manuals showing threaded pommels so it's not really a matter of one being less authentic than the other just different ways to do the same thing, at least for 15th century and later. I haven't seen any threaded swords in museums so far but that doesn't mean there never were any or that it's even visible today.

Anyway, the new look is a good look. I wouldn't have thought anything wrong with the old version either though.

"The Dwarf sees farther than the Giant when he has the giant's shoulder to mount on" -Coleridge
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Craig L.




PostPosted: Sun 06 Nov, 2011 4:08 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Tom Kinder wrote:
...but we will be offering traditional hot peening fairly soon.
Now THAT will be an exciting day! To this point, I've had to forego ATrim swords because -- like several others above -- I just can't handle the hex nut assembly. I'm really looking forward to the traditional hot peening. Happy
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Luka Borscak




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PostPosted: Sun 06 Nov, 2011 5:11 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Craig L. wrote:
Tom Kinder wrote:
...but we will be offering traditional hot peening fairly soon.
Now THAT will be an exciting day! To this point, I've had to forego ATrim swords because -- like several others above -- I just can't handle the hex nut assembly. I'm really looking forward to the traditional hot peening. Happy


My thoughts exactly. And I wouldn't mind some Atrim bare blades for sale either. Wink
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Tom Kinder





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PostPosted: Wed 09 Nov, 2011 11:57 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

in response to my original post a lot of people said they wanted a smoother finish so I thought I'd see if this was more the idea they were trying to get at:


what do you guys think?

the hot peening solution will be a reality very soon. I now have the equipment I need to do it and earlier today Gus mailed me the first sword with the modified furniture to get hot peened. I just might have pictures of a hot peened sword by Monday. stay tuned.
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Chad Arnow
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PostPosted: Thu 10 Nov, 2011 5:55 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

I don't think flush grinding it is all that much better than a peen you can see and feel. While some historical swords were ground flush, many have a peen that stands up from the surface. Some people may prefer one to the other, but both are historical.
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Tom Kinder





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PostPosted: Thu 10 Nov, 2011 7:21 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

I intend to make both options available. thanks for the input.
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Ralph Grinly





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PostPosted: Thu 10 Nov, 2011 12:54 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

While flush ground peens are historically correct, I feel that if used..there'll always be questions on just how much of a countersink there is on the pommel? If the peen is NOT ground flush..one can always tell if there is a decent amount of metal holding everything together ? I know all reputable makers would ensure there was a decent countersink, but still feel they'll always be questioned ?
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Michael Ahrens




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PostPosted: Thu 10 Nov, 2011 3:22 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Tom

Gotta say I love the peened versions very much. However I have two words for you "Scent Stopper" keep up the good work!!!

Mike

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Tom Kinder





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PostPosted: Thu 10 Nov, 2011 4:34 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Mike, thank you. I have 1000 words for you:


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Jimi Edmonds




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PostPosted: Thu 10 Nov, 2011 10:42 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

I have been looking into Atrim swords for a good cutter, but as was noted above about the Scent Stopper when abouts would those start appearing? I like the scent stoppers much more that a disk pommel [was a draw for me to Albions Liechtenauer]..and that pommel that is shown above looks rather nice, and hot peening would be a good plus aswell...hex nuts just don't do it for me....so your guys XVI a3 sword with a scent pommel and peened would be mean!!
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Tom Kinder





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PostPosted: Fri 11 Nov, 2011 12:24 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Thanks Jimi,

hand forged scent stoppers like that cost about $150 and they start appearing when they are commissioned. that one is sold and the sword it goes on is currently with Christian Fletcher. I don't have them listed on the website because they are custom pieces and not production. perhaps I should list that I will do them.

I should probably have the first hot peened Tried and True ATrim ready by the end of the weekend.

won't be long before hot peening is and everyday option.
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