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Einar Drønnesund





Joined: 14 Sep 2003
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PostPosted: Sun 10 Jul, 2011 1:04 pm    Post subject: Second attempt at twisted wire hilt wrap         Reply with quote

So, after doing the simple wrap on my viking sword http://www.myArmoury.com/talk/viewtopic.php?t=23472 I felt I needed to practice a bit before doing a more complex wrap. I didnt have any suitable pieces of wood to practice on, but, hey, nothing wrong with pimping a HEMA modified shinai, right? Wink

So I decided to attempt an iron wire herringbone style wrap with a twisted copper wire in between. It looks a bit over the top, but thats the wire I had available. The copper stands out more in the pics than in real life. The iron wire is 0.7 mm and the copper is 0.5 mm thick. I used about 16 yards of copper and and 32 yards of iron wire to make the twisted strands.

The iron is a lot more difficult to work with because its harder and more springy than the copper and wants to unwind itself from the hilt if you dont keep a very firm grip as you wind it on. If you'd like to try this yourself, I recommend using a long hall, or doing it outside, so you can clamp down the end of all three wires and keep them taut as you rotate the sword to wind them on. I did it freehand instead, and ended up with very sore fingers.

Seeing how this looks, I think I'll redo the viking sword with iron wire, herringbone pattern, but without the copper accent wire, as thats just a tad too fancy for me.




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Myles Mulkey





Joined: 31 Jul 2008

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PostPosted: Mon 11 Jul, 2011 7:08 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

That's really nice. Good job. I think once the copper gets a patina going and the iron starts rusting/darkening in the low spots, you should go over the surface with some fine steel wool. That will make the high spots shine out but the low spots won't be touched. Then the whole thing should really pop out at you. Really nice job Einar.
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Einar Drønnesund





Joined: 14 Sep 2003
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PostPosted: Mon 11 Jul, 2011 7:24 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Myles Mulkey wrote:
That's really nice. Good job. I think once the copper gets a patina going and the iron starts rusting/darkening in the low spots, you should go over the surface with some fine steel wool. That will make the high spots shine out but the low spots won't be touched. Then the whole thing should really pop out at you. Really nice job Einar.


Thank you very much. Yeah the copper might start to look a bit better with some patina. Right now it just looks a bit too new and shiny. But I'm happy with the result and will be doing more wire wraps soon. I have an Angus Trim bare blade that I want to do a half leather, half wire wrap on. And I have just butchered an old leather jacket of mine for the leather. Cool
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Eric G.




Location: Arizona
Joined: 08 Feb 2011
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PostPosted: Mon 11 Jul, 2011 6:08 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

This looks very nice.

I think I speak for more than just myself when I say that I would love to hear more about where you got your materials and how you executed the details of this.

Eric Gregersen
www.EricGregersen.com
Knowledge applied is power.
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Tod Glenn




Location: Helena MT
Joined: 05 Sep 2008
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PostPosted: Mon 11 Jul, 2011 8:45 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Nice job. I lacquer my wire wraps after I solder the ends and then buff off the lacquer on the outer surface. This prevents the wire from coming loose. Also be warned that if you wrap over wood, the wood is likely to shrink and the whole thing loosens up. Use a hardwood core - preferably one that's been stabilized.

At the start and finish of the wrap you can drill a couple of holes with a wire gauge drill and pull the wires through. Carefully solder the first and last loop with low temperature silver solder and it will last a long time.
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Tod Glenn




Location: Helena MT
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PostPosted: Mon 11 Jul, 2011 8:47 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

BTW, you can use a spring clamp to hold the wire on the grip while winding to give you hand a rest.
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Einar Drønnesund





Joined: 14 Sep 2003
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PostPosted: Tue 12 Jul, 2011 3:40 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Eric Gregersen wrote:
This looks very nice.

I think I speak for more than just myself when I say that I would love to hear more about where you got your materials and how you executed the details of this.


Would be my pleasure.

I got the wire in a hobby and crafts shop. The kind where you can get beads and stuff to make home made jewelry. They have many different kinds of iron, steel and copper wire.

When twisting the wire, I use an electric drill with a curtain hook in the chuck. Lay the wire double in a long loop, clamp the ends to something, pull it taut (but dont put too much pressure on it) hook the curtain hook to the end of the loop and twist away. It only takes a few minutes per strand. If the wire is a bit wobbly and bent from the spool, you dont need to worry. It will twist evenly once you get a couple of dozen revolutions. Like I said, dont put too much pressure on it, or it can break. And it will almost certainly break at the drill end of the wire. If it does, it'll corkscrew a bit, but might still be useable, especially if its soft and pliable iron or copper wire. Dont use stainless. Its MUCH harder and springier and you'll utter many a curse as it tries to unwind itself from the grip as youre trying to lock off the ends. :P

Once you're happy with the look of it, give the drill a few revs the other way. If you just release the wire without dong that, it'll corkscrew. Just use the drill to twist it back the other way 10 revs or so, and keep a firm grip on the wire as you release it from the hook. It'll unwind a bit between your fingers, but as long as you slow that unwinding down by keeping a firm grip on it, it wont corkscrew.

To get the herringbone pattern, you simply make two separate twisted strands, one twisted clockwise, the other anti clockwise. And no, you cant just twist them the same way and turn one around 180 degrees. The twist goes the same way, no matter how you turn it. I tried. lol.

To start off with the wrap, I drill a hole on the thin side of the grip (the one facing down when the sword is in the scabbard. Do this on the narrowest part of the grip, which will usually be the pommel side. As you wind on the wire, it will want to slide towards the narrow end of the grip, making it easier to get a nice, even wrap. When doing multiple wires at once, like I did on the shinai, you might need one hole for each strand, with a bit of spacing, all along the pommel side, to avoid any big gaps at the start when you start winding them on to the grip. (sorry, I dont know how to explain that. You'll probably understand what I mean when you try it. On the shinai I didnt do this, and just covered the gaps at the ends with black faux leather*)

First off all, i epoxy one end of each strand in their individual holes and wait until it sets before I start the wrapping. Clamp down the other ends of all the wires, so they all have about the same amount of tension when you pull on the handle of the sword. Cover the grip with a thin layer of epoxy. Then its just a matter of turning the sword round and round, keeping the tension on the wires the whole time, making sure they dont cross over eachother, and that they lie firmly against eachother as you twist the sword.

Once you're done, clamp the ends of the wires to the grip, making sure they dont come loose, as it'll unwind on you, and you'll lose many karma points by swearing loudly. If you have someone to help you, this is much easier, as one can hold the wires tight, while the other attaches the clamp. Wait until the epoxy sets, and hey presto, you're done.


*Electrical tape Razz
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Einar Drønnesund





Joined: 14 Sep 2003
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PostPosted: Tue 12 Jul, 2011 3:43 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Tod Glenn wrote:
Nice job. I lacquer my wire wraps after I solder the ends and then buff off the lacquer on the outer surface. This prevents the wire from coming loose. Also be warned that if you wrap over wood, the wood is likely to shrink and the whole thing loosens up. Use a hardwood core - preferably one that's been stabilized.

At the start and finish of the wrap you can drill a couple of holes with a wire gauge drill and pull the wires through. Carefully solder the first and last loop with low temperature silver solder and it will last a long time.


Thanks for the tips. I dont have any soldering equipment, so I have just used epoxy so far. Seems to hold up well though.

Edit: I just updated the viking sword thread if you'd like to see how my third attempt went.

http://www.myArmoury.com/talk/viewtopic.php?p=226630#226630
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